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Apple vs the FBI

indocom

Mar 3, 2016
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Couldn't they simply remove the flash chip or chips from the device and read them something other than an iPhone? I doubt that the program that erases everything after 10 wrong keys are entered would be inside the flash chip.

The data is presumably encrypted, but there are only 10000 possible 4-digit keys, easy enough to crack.

Bob

are u sure? you need more truly source about this topic.
 

BobK

Jan 5, 2010
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are u sure? you need more truly source about this topic.
Words like "Couldn't they", and "I presume" indicate speculation, not certainty.

Do you have better information for us?

Bob
 

Herschel Peeler

Feb 21, 2016
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Re: remove the Flash
Bypass the operating system and get to Flash directly? I don't know how the device is built. The Flash could be internal to the processor.
 

BobK

Jan 5, 2010
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Re: remove the Flash
Bypass the operating system and get to Flash directly? I don't know how the device is built. The Flash could be internal to the processor.
I already covered that. It is a separate chip.

From a teardown:

Toshiba THGBX2G7B2JLA01 128 Gb (16 GB) NAND flash

Bob
 

cjdelphi

Oct 26, 2011
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Obviously you guys never watched the video on how to bypass the encryption on an Iphone!

Full instructions in the video!

 

Herschel Peeler

Feb 21, 2016
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A terrorist walks into a bar...

But seriously, folks...a terrorist walks into Kroger and buys bread. Can (not should) Kroger be prosecuted for supporting terrorism?

And - a known terrorist walks into Kroger and buys bread. Can (not should) Kroger be prosecuted for supporting terrorism?

ak

The bread is not specifically designed to aid the criminal activity. Are these phones specifically bought for this feature by those intending to use it for a criminal activity? Planning to commit a crime should wave rights to privacy from the government.
I also think the FBI would like to set a history of requiring the manufacturers to comply with a warrant. How many manufacturers of phones are there? How many models? This question is bigger than just Apple.
 
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Gryd3

Jun 25, 2014
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The bread is not specifically designed to aid the criminal activity.
iPhone was not 'specifically designed' to aid criminal activity. It's a privacy/security 'tool'. Like any 'tool' it can be used for more than the intended purpose.
The bread is food for the criminal. Without food the criminal could not proceed to do criminal like activities.
So, perhaps you need a fingerprint scanner in every grocery outlet to help ensure criminals don't have access to resources that allow them to continue their unjust actions.
 

Gryd3

Jun 25, 2014
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This thread started as an inquiry as to why the FBI couldn't access the contents and has turned into a debate that is going nowhere.
What you are talking about Herschel is absolute transparency. It can't be obtained because of privacy related tech and code from Apple. You do realize that 'encryption' can be done with a pen and paper, or 3rd party apps on Android, iPhone, Windows Mobile, Linux, MacOS, etc... asking a company to make a back-door will not solve any problems and magically decrypt everything. People will simply stop using the product or start using other forms of protection.
 

Herschel Peeler

Feb 21, 2016
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I already covered that. It is a separate chip.

From a teardown:

Toshiba THGBX2G7B2JLA01 128 Gb (16 GB) NAND flash

Bob

Thanks. I missed that post. No surprise I couldn't find a data sheet for a custom part. I assume there is a way to upgrade the program of the internal processor? So what the FBI wants done can be accomplished by just a few lines of code changes. It is a question of SHOULD it be done, not IF it can be done.
 

Herschel Peeler

Feb 21, 2016
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iPhone was not 'specifically designed' to aid criminal activity. It's a privacy/security 'tool'. Like any 'tool' it can be used for more than the intended purpose.
The bread is food for the criminal. Without food the criminal could not proceed to do criminal like activities.
So, perhaps you need a fingerprint scanner in every grocery outlet to help ensure criminals don't have access to resources that allow them to continue their unjust actions.

There doesn't seem to be a bad argument on either side on this question. I won't be unhappy any way it turns out.
 

Herschel Peeler

Feb 21, 2016
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This thread started as an inquiry as to why the FBI couldn't access the contents and has turned into a debate that is going nowhere.
What you are talking about Herschel is absolute transparency. It can't be obtained because of privacy related tech and code from Apple. You do realize that 'encryption' can be done with a pen and paper, or 3rd party apps on Android, iPhone, Windows Mobile, Linux, MacOS, etc... asking a company to make a back-door will not solve any problems and magically decrypt everything. People will simply stop using the product or start using other forms of protection.

The 'back door isn't the same thing. A back door is an access around the encryption process. What the FBI is asking for here is just to undo the lockout on wrong guesses. They are not basking Apple to reveal any secrets of their software. People (criminals) may stop using the product that can be accessed by the FBI. Are legit businesses afraid of the FBI? I think not.
 

Herschel Peeler

Feb 21, 2016
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Are the criminals the only ones losing privacy on this question?
Those who do not encrypt are not concerned. T^hose not engaged in criminal activity are not involved. The only ones being protected by blocking the FBI's request are criminals.
 
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