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audiophile capacitor replacement

E

Eric

Jan 1, 1970
0
Hi,

I have a question about the audiophile capacitor replacement. In normal
production boards, signal coupling capacitor normally using polar
electrolytic capacitors. In some higher grade models, bi-polar electrolytic
capacitors will be introduced. Some people will upgrade it will audio grade
capacitors such as oil caps, polypropylene caps. In my audio device, the
coupling caps are 100uF polar electrolytic caps. I am looking for Jensen
oil caps and it will be very expensive and the size is very big. Someone
suggests me I can replace with 20uF oil caps instead of huge big one. If it
is right, is there any rule of thumb to do the exchange calculation or any
theory behind the idea. It seems the capacitor values will be 5 times lower
than the original value and I am worry about the filter DC function. Thanks
a lot for any input for the information.
 
F

Frederic

Jan 1, 1970
0
Eric said:
Hi,

I have a question about the audiophile capacitor replacement. In normal
production boards, signal coupling capacitor normally using polar
electrolytic capacitors. In some higher grade models, bi-polar
electrolytic capacitors will be introduced. Some people will upgrade it
will audio grade capacitors such as oil caps, polypropylene caps. In my
audio device, the coupling caps are 100uF polar electrolytic caps. I am
looking for Jensen oil caps and it will be very expensive and the size is
very big. Someone suggests me I can replace with 20uF oil caps instead of
huge big one. If it is right, is there any rule of thumb to do the
exchange calculation or any theory behind the idea. It seems the
capacitor values will be 5 times lower than the original value and I am
worry about the filter DC function. Thanks a lot for any input for the
information.

100uF is quite a big value for coupling unless the stage is driving a low
impedance load. You cannot reduce the value otherwise the low frequency
response will suffer.
An alternative is to use 100uF tantalum bypassed by a few uF polypropylene,
that should reduce the nonlinearity produced by the tantalum.

Unless you mean "decoupling" caps, in that case normal electrolytic will do.

Fred
 
J

John Larkin

Jan 1, 1970
0
Hi,

I have a question about the audiophile capacitor replacement. In normal
production boards, signal coupling capacitor normally using polar
electrolytic capacitors. In some higher grade models, bi-polar electrolytic
capacitors will be introduced. Some people will upgrade it will audio grade
capacitors such as oil caps, polypropylene caps. In my audio device, the
coupling caps are 100uF polar electrolytic caps. I am looking for Jensen
oil caps and it will be very expensive and the size is very big. Someone
suggests me I can replace with 20uF oil caps instead of huge big one. If it
is right, is there any rule of thumb to do the exchange calculation or any
theory behind the idea. It seems the capacitor values will be 5 times lower
than the original value and I am worry about the filter DC function. Thanks
a lot for any input for the information.

Spend as much money as will please you. It won't change the sound at
all.

John
 
D

D from BC

Jan 1, 1970
0
Spend as much money as will please you. It won't change the sound at
all.

John

Perfect sound is great if you have perfect ears..
I've heard that as one gets older, there is more hearing loss at the
high end....
If one has damaged hearing then what's the point of perfect audio?
After a hearing test some years ago...I was told I have some damage in
the 3khz area.
New audiophile project: Worlds largest hearing aid with gigantic
capacitors :)
If the genetic engineers turn into audiophiles, people will probably
end up with 6 giant ears :)
D from BC
 
E

Eeyore

Jan 1, 1970
0
Eric said:
Hi,

I have a question about the audiophile capacitor replacement. In normal
production boards, signal coupling capacitor normally using polar
electrolytic capacitors. In some higher grade models, bi-polar electrolytic
capacitors will be introduced. Some people will upgrade it will audio grade
capacitors such as oil caps, polypropylene caps. In my audio device, the
coupling caps are 100uF polar electrolytic caps.

There's a very good reason for that.

I am looking for Jensen
oil caps and it will be very expensive and the size is very big.

Vegetable oil or mineral oil ? You know it makes a difference. :~)

Someone
suggests me I can replace with 20uF oil caps instead of huge big one. If it
is right, is there any rule of thumb to do the exchange calculation or any
theory behind the idea. It seems the capacitor values will be 5 times lower
than the original value and I am worry about the filter DC function. Thanks
a lot for any input for the information.

I suggest you save your money for something that will actually makes a
difference instead of just being able to make 'I've got a big dick' style
boasts.

Unless of course you simply enjoy wasting money.

If you fancy being different you could fit 'low ESR' 100uF electrolytics. It
still won't sound any different but you'll be seen as having 'made an effort'
and you can then make interesting claims about the sonic properties of 'low ESR'
caps that others have previously missed.

Graham
 
E

Eeyore

Jan 1, 1970
0
Frederic said:
100uF is quite a big value for coupling unless the stage is driving a low
impedance load.

There's a very good reason for it.
You cannot reduce the value otherwise the low frequency
response will suffer.

Infrasonic response maybe.

Graham
 
Eric said:
Hi,

I have a question about the audiophile capacitor replacement. In normal
production boards, signal coupling capacitor normally using polar
electrolytic capacitors. In some higher grade models, bi-polar electrolytic
capacitors will be introduced. Some people will upgrade it will audio grade
capacitors such as oil caps, polypropylene caps. In my audio device, the
coupling caps are 100uF polar electrolytic caps. I am looking for Jensen
oil caps and it will be very expensive and the size is very big. Someone
suggests me I can replace with 20uF oil caps instead of huge big one. If it
is right, is there any rule of thumb to do the exchange calculation or any
theory behind the idea. It seems the capacitor values will be 5 times lower
than the original value and I am worry about the filter DC function. Thanks
a lot for any input for the information.

If there is any measurable effects due to capacitors, the voltage
coefficient is the place to start looking. Larger value caps will not
make a difference, other than to push the lower frequency response
deeper. In reality, there are circuit designs to get around most
capacitor coupling, though this generally involves a servo circuit to
remove DC. [Servo circuits can cause low frequency distortion.]

Self (Richard, I think) did a paper on the distortion effects of
passive components. It is a useful paper to read.
 
B

Bruce Varley

Jan 1, 1970
0
John Larkin said:
Spend as much money as will please you. It won't change the sound at
all.

John

No joke, this came from a serious study. More intelligent people are less
concernced with the fidelity of the music they listen to.
 
E

Eeyore

Jan 1, 1970
0
Bruce said:
No joke, this came from a serious study. More intelligent people are less
concernced with the fidelity of the music they listen to.

What exactly came from a serious study ?

Graham
 
T

Terry Given

Jan 1, 1970
0
Eric said:
Hi,

I have a question about the audiophile capacitor replacement. In normal
production boards, signal coupling capacitor normally using polar
electrolytic capacitors. In some higher grade models, bi-polar electrolytic
capacitors will be introduced. Some people will upgrade it will audio grade
capacitors such as oil caps, polypropylene caps. In my audio device, the
coupling caps are 100uF polar electrolytic caps. I am looking for Jensen
oil caps and it will be very expensive and the size is very big. Someone
suggests me I can replace with 20uF oil caps instead of huge big one. If it
is right, is there any rule of thumb to do the exchange calculation or any
theory behind the idea. It seems the capacitor values will be 5 times lower
than the original value and I am worry about the filter DC function. Thanks
a lot for any input for the information.


If there is any measurable effects due to capacitors, the voltage
coefficient is the place to start looking. Larger value caps will not
make a difference, other than to push the lower frequency response
deeper. In reality, there are circuit designs to get around most
capacitor coupling, though this generally involves a servo circuit to
remove DC. [Servo circuits can cause low frequency distortion.]

Self (Richard, I think) did a paper on the distortion effects of
passive components. It is a useful paper to read.

Douglas Self.

He also wrote a very good book - Audio Power Amplifier Design Handbook.
And he thinks audiophiles are astonishingly stupid (there is an entire
chapter on this subject).

Cheers
Terry
 
D

D from BC

Jan 1, 1970
0
It's just hilarious at the amount of audiophile bashing going on here.

Maybe the OP is still trying to get that live sound from a Black
Sabbath live CD and the distortion just doesn't quite sound right.. :)
D from BC
 
F

Frederic

Jan 1, 1970
0
Eeyore said:
There's a very good reason for it.


Infrasonic response maybe.

Not infrasonic, just sonic :))
At least down to 20Hz. The 100uF is ok to drive a small speaker or a
headphone...

Fred
 
J

John Larkin

Jan 1, 1970
0
It's just hilarious at the amount of audiophile bashing going on here.

Audiophiles shouldn't post to sed. I don't recall one ever asking an
intelligent question. They have their own groups where they can argue
over their various superstitions.

John
 
P

PeteS

Jan 1, 1970
0
John said:
Audiophiles shouldn't post to sed. I don't recall one ever asking an
intelligent question. They have their own groups where they can argue
over their various superstitions.

John
But you must admit, John, it gives us some good (high profit) product
ideas ;)

Cheers

PeteS
 
D

D from BC

Jan 1, 1970
0
But you must admit, John, it gives us some good (high profit) product
ideas ;)

Cheers

PeteS

The Low Oxygen Monster Cable guy is probably in the sun right now
sipping on sambuca and getting a back massage from some DD bikini
babe.. :)
D from BC
 
D

Dirk Bruere at NeoPax

Jan 1, 1970
0
D said:
Perfect sound is great if you have perfect ears..
I've heard that as one gets older, there is more hearing loss at the
high end....
If one has damaged hearing then what's the point of perfect audio?
After a hearing test some years ago...I was told I have some damage in
the 3khz area.
New audiophile project: Worlds largest hearing aid with gigantic
capacitors :)
If the genetic engineers turn into audiophiles, people will probably
end up with 6 giant ears :)
D from BC

Then why not use a DSP to tailor the frequency response of your system
to your hearing? Behringer DCX2496 - $250

--
Dirk

http://www.onetribe.me.uk - The UK's only occult talk show
Presented by Dirk Bruere and Marc Power on ResonanceFM 104.4
http://www.resonancefm.com
 
E

Eeyore

Jan 1, 1970
0
If there is any measurable effects due to capacitors, the voltage
coefficient is the place to start looking. Larger value caps will not
make a difference

Yes they will since the same current flowing through a larger cap produces less
voltage across its plates.

This is precisely why normal electrolytic caps can be used fine in 'zero bias'
coupling. It does require large capacitance values like 100uF though.

Graham
 
E

Eeyore

Jan 1, 1970
0
Terry said:
Douglas Self.

He also wrote a very good book - Audio Power Amplifier Design Handbook.
And he thinks audiophiles are astonishingly stupid (there is an entire
chapter on this subject).

He's over-rated IMHO.

Graham
 
T

Terry Given

Jan 1, 1970
0
Eeyore said:
Terry Given wrote:




He's over-rated IMHO.

Graham

why do you think that?

he explains everything he does, using actual engineering, rather than
audio mysticism.

Cheers
Terry
 
E

Eeyore

Jan 1, 1970
0
Terry said:
why do you think that?

Long story. He also talks a lot but AFAIK is responsible for very few real-world
amplifiers.

he explains everything he does, using actual engineering, rather than
audio mysticism.

So can I .

Graham
 
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