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Does static electricity travel via metal only ? or plastics too ?

  • Thread starter Skybuck The Destroyer
  • Start date
S

Skybuck The Destroyer

Jan 1, 1970
0
Hello,

My question is:

Does static electricity travel via metal only ? or plastics too ?

The back of the pc has a metal (?) brace which is part of the
motherboard.

I touched it, and maybe could have damaged the motherboard that way.

If so, then ofcourse it's the designers, in this asus, own fault !

They should use material which do not allow static electricity to
transfer ???!!!???

Or are there other safety concerns ?

Maybe metal is good ? (Don't think so though ;))

What your toughts on that ? :p*

Bye,
Skybuck.

P.S.: Posted to dutch newgroup too, hope that's ok :), reply in
english please :)
 
M

Michael W. Ryder

Jan 1, 1970
0
Skybuck said:
Hello,

My question is:

Does static electricity travel via metal only ? or plastics too ?

Static electricity travels very well through air. In the early 80's I
watched people in an office that had just installed shag carpet "launch"
bolts of static electricity several inches to the terminals. This made
a great show of jiggling on the screen and probably didn't help their
lifespan any.

The back of the pc has a metal (?) brace which is part of the
motherboard.

I touched it, and maybe could have damaged the motherboard that way.

If so, then ofcourse it's the designers, in this asus, own fault !

They should use material which do not allow static electricty to
transfer ???!!!???

Exactly how do you prevent "bad" electricity through a wire but not
"good" electricity? What might have happened is that your static charge
traveled to the metal connector for the USB port and from there through
the computer.
Or are there other safety concerns ?

Maybe metal is good ? (Don't think so though ;))

What your toughts on that ? :p*

If you want to cut down your static risk use a fabric softener like Dawn
and spray the carpet around the computer. It won't eliminate it
completely but will make a difference. Otherwise place the computer in
a clean room with Tempest shielding.
 
M

mpm

Jan 1, 1970
0
On Jun 1, 3:19?pm, Skybuck The Destroyer


The metal part you are talking about is probably connected to ground.
And discharge through ground should not affect the motherboard.

Yes, a static current flowing in the ground circuit (fault) is not
ideal, but I don't know that it would damage a motherboard directly?
Are you the individual who posted recently that you had (2)
motherboards die? If so, I am wondering if something else isn't
wrong?? How many motherboards would it take? Are you building /
upgrading the PC yourself? Are you using static control measures
while handling the boards and semiconductors?

Just a few thoughts to ponder. mpm
 
J

Jaap Knasterhuis

Jan 1, 1970
0
Hello,

My question is:

Does static electricity travel via metal only ? or plastics too ?

The back of the pc has a metal (?) brace which is part of the
motherboard.

I touched it, and maybe could have damaged the motherboard that way.

If so, then ofcourse it's the designers, in this asus, own fault !

They should use material which do not allow static electricty to
transfer ???!!!???

Or are there other safety concerns ?

Maybe metal is good ? (Don't think so though ;))

What your toughts on that ? :p*

Bye,
Skybuck.

P.S.: Posted to dutch newgroup too, hope that's ok :), reply in
english please :)



Het is eigenlijk heel simpel.
Een ESD veilige ruimte is in de meeste thuis situaties niet altijd te
realiseren, maar je kunt daarentegen heel eenvoudig je apparatuur
voorzien van randaarde. Een ESD ontlading zoekt altijd de weg van de
minste weerstand en dat is de randaarde.
Mocht je nu aan je PC willen knutselen, dan zorg je voor een
anti-statische mat die je vervolgens met de juiste middelen aan de
randaarde koppelt, je plaatst daar je PC op (het netsnoer laat je
zitten tot het moment dat je apparatuur daadwerkelijk op de mat staat)
en je verbindt jezelf met een daartoe geschikte polsband aan deze
anti-statische mat.
De anti-statische mat is dus je virtuele aardpunt.
Als je nu ook nog beschermende koolstof kleding draagt tijdens de
klus, dan hoef je nergens meer over in te zitten.


JK
 
M

mr deo

Jan 1, 1970
0
mpm said:
On Jun 1, 3:19?pm, Skybuck The Destroyer


The metal part you are talking about is probably connected to ground.
And discharge through ground should not affect the motherboard.

Yes, a static current flowing in the ground circuit (fault) is not
ideal, but I don't know that it would damage a motherboard directly?

No, it shouldnt..

I know that all stages of the PSU share a common ground, and I think that
common ground is return'd to the Earth/Ground of the plug.
 
M

mr deo

Jan 1, 1970
0
Bye,
Skybuck.

P.S.: Posted to dutch newgroup too, hope that's ok :), reply in
english please :)

Hi Skybuck
I have been following your problems and I know what the problem is..

It's user error. I suggest you box up your dream pc, your static flip flops
or whatever, and go buy a dell laptop.
 
D

default

Jan 1, 1970
0
Hello,

My question is:

Does static electricity travel via metal only ? or plastics too ?

The back of the pc has a metal (?) brace which is part of the
motherboard.

I touched it, and maybe could have damaged the motherboard that way.

If so, then ofcourse it's the designers, in this asus, own fault !

They should use material which do not allow static electricty to
transfer ???!!!???

Or are there other safety concerns ?

Maybe metal is good ? (Don't think so though ;))

What your toughts on that ? :p*

Bye,
Skybuck.

P.S.: Posted to dutch newgroup too, hope that's ok :), reply in
english please :)

Static can go through some plastics - usually ones the manufacturer
takes steps to make them conductive. Static can pass through wood if
reasonably moist. Static will always travel via metals - but not
necessarily metal oxides.

Static can build up on the surfaces of insulated conductors,
insulators, and semi conductive insulated pieces.

Have a negative ion generator in the room? That's is asking for
trouble.

The problem isn't the board maker - it is you. Good practice says
that you be at the same voltage potential as the computer before you
touch anything inside it. Easiest way is ground yourself and the
computer, then touch things inside.

Avoid working when the air is dry and be very careful.
 
E

Eeyore

Jan 1, 1970
0
Skybuck said:
I touched it, and maybe could have damaged the motherboard that way.

If so, then ofcourse it's the designers, in this asus, own fault !

They should use material which do not allow static electricty to
transfer ???!!!???

You're supposed to discharge any static on yourself before touching these
things.

Better still, avoid wearing the kinds of clothing that 'generate static' (in
other words wear pure cotton only - no synthetic content) and also treat any
carpet in the area with an anti-static spray to avoid generating static
electricity when you walk across it.

If you broke something with static it was only your own stupidity and ignorance
that was to blame. It is impossible to make the internal components of a PC
totally Skybuck The Idiot proof.

Graham
 
T

Ty

Jan 1, 1970
0
Skybuck said:
Hello,

My question is:

Does static electricity travel via metal only ? or plastics too ?

static and or electricity seek ground. plastic is normally an insulator
but can be persuaded to conduct until a vaporized/magma state is
achieved. This type of situation beyond the norm, like natural purple
hair sticky.
 
R

Ruben van der Leij

Jan 1, 1970
0
P.S.: Posted to dutch newgroup too, hope that's ok :), reply in
english please :)

En wat nu als we dat niet doen? Gaan dan al die Engelsen in paniek raken ofzo?
 
V

victor

Jan 1, 1970
0
Ruben van der Leij said:
En wat nu als we dat niet doen? Gaan dan al die Engelsen in paniek
raken ofzo?

--
Ruben

Misfortune, n.: The kind of fortune that never misses.
-- Ambrose Bierce, "The Devil's Dictionary"

Maar gelukkig heb je wel een indrukwekkende Engelse sig.
 
S

Skybuck

Jan 1, 1970
0
No just one, the other died many years ago.

Using no measurements, except: touching the heating/radiator.

Someone once said that helps get rid of static electricity ? ;)

But I probably didn't do that when I connected the mouse.

Also I wonder if it really helps and how much do I get rid of it ?

Because I was probably heavily loaded with static elec...

Bye,
Skybuck.
 
S

Skybuck

Jan 1, 1970
0
Het is eigenlijk heel simpel.
Een ESD veilige ruimte is in de meeste thuis situaties niet altijd te
realiseren, maar je kunt daarentegen heel eenvoudig je apparatuur
voorzien van randaarde. Een ESD ontlading zoekt altijd de weg van de
minste weerstand en dat is de randaarde.
Mocht je nu aan je PC willen knutselen, dan zorg je voor een
anti-statische mat die je vervolgens met de juiste middelen aan de
randaarde koppelt, je plaatst daar je PC op (het netsnoer laat je
zitten tot het moment dat je apparatuur daadwerkelijk op de mat staat)
en je verbindt jezelf met een daartoe geschikte polsband aan deze
anti-statische mat.
De anti-statische mat is dus je virtuele aardpunt.
Als je nu ook nog beschermende koolstof kleding draagt tijdens de
klus, dan hoef je nergens meer over in te zitten.

JK- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Wat is dat randaarde ?

Is de verwarming/radiator verbonden met de aarde ?

Ik snap daar geen hol von.

Doei,
Skybuck.
 
S

Skybuck

Jan 1, 1970
0
You're supposed to discharge any static on yourself before touching these
things.

Better still, avoid wearing the kinds of clothing that 'generate static' (in
other words wear pure cotton only - no synthetic content) and also treat any
carpet in the area with an anti-static spray to avoid generating static
electricity when you walk across it.

If you broke something with static it was only your own stupidity and ignorance
that was to blame. It is impossible to make the internal components of a PC
totally Skybuck The Idiot proof.

Graham

I disagree, static electricty, ground, and things like that are beyond
the understanding of everyday people that use computers.

My sister, my mother, my brother, your uncle, anybody could connect a
mouse and damage a piece of hardware.

It's the hardware designers job to try and prevent that from happening
as much as possible =D

Bye,
Skybuck.
 
J

Jaap Knasterhuis

Jan 1, 1970
0
Wat is dat randaarde ?

Is de verwarming/radiator verbonden met de aarde ?

Ik snap daar geen hol von.

Doei,
Skybuck.



Dat is intussen wel duidelijk geworden!

JK
 
D

default

Jan 1, 1970
0
I disagree, static electricty, ground, and things like that are beyond
the understanding of everyday people that use computers.

My sister, my mother, my brother, your uncle, anybody could connect a
mouse and damage a piece of hardware.

It's the hardware designers job to try and prevent that from happening
as much as possible =D

Bye,
Skybuck.

Computers and the Internet are beyond the understanding of everyday
people that use computers, that doesn't stop them.

OK NEW RULE: no one is allowed to buy a computer without first
demonstrating complete mastery of the computer.

More seriously:

All engineering is compromise. You learn to make the best choices
operating within the scope of what is possible, and practical. All
solutions to problems contain the seeds of other, different, problems.

I think the manufacturers do plenty to make computers resistant to
static discharge. The problem is that when conductors and insulators
are measured in angstroms, there just isn't enough conductor or
insulating material there to withstand high potentials.

Insulation resistance is measured in volts per mil. Large scale
integrated circuit fabrications are orders of magnitude thinner.
Static discharges are thousands of volts.

The problem is intrinsic to the parts themselves. Use other parts?
Can't - - - or can but then the computer takes up a lot of room,
becomes slower, costs much more, and can't run the graphical software
your sister,mother,brother,uncle,et al can use.

Remember the old UNIVAC? sucked down tons of power, you had to learn
machine language to program it, no memory to speak of, not user
friendly, unreliable as all get out, but static electricity (short of
a lightening strike on the mainframe) wouldn't damage it.

Perhaps when the technology changes and photons become logical
elements or biologic self-repairing computers come along, it won't be
a problem. Until then this is the state of the technology available.

You are the one having the problem - it isn't as universal as you
probably think. Most of us know about it and how to work without
destroying the stuff.

Cost is still a factor too. A 100% metal shell keyboard, would be
better, heavy and costly. Connectors could be made that make the
ground connection before internal works are exposed to static, they
may be so large, and costly, as to be impractical.

There's no such thing as idiot proof. You wouldn't expect your car to
go without oil or coolant, is that a weakness in the design? Could
cars be designed to work without oil or coolant? Probably - low
thermal coefficient high temperature ceramics, increased pollution due
to wider tolerances, and a cost no one could afford.

Until the technology changes, why not just learn how to deal with the
limitations? It is the only choice, and griping about it won't change
it.

Why do you have so much trouble in accepting that you did something
wrong? Learn from it, stop doing it, and move on.

Your question: "Does static electricity travel via metal only ? or
plastics too ?" speaks volumes of your own lack of understanding. It
isn't a weakness to be ignorant about something, it is a weakness to
be unable to learn because of one's bias.
 
B

Ben Doedens

Jan 1, 1970
0
Skybuck said:
Wat is dat randaarde ?
Is de verwarming/radiator verbonden met de aarde ?
Ik snap daar geen hol von.

Waar ben je grootgebracht? In Engeland spreken ze nml niet over randaarde,
maar over live (bruine draad), neutral (blauwe draad) and ground
(geel/groene of grijze draad) en hebben ze driepolige stopcontacten en
stekkers.

In Nederland gebruiken we het begrip "randaarde" omdat de aarding aan de
rand van de stekkers en contactdozen zit. De aarddraad van
woonhuisaansluitingen bestaat uit een koperen pijp die enkele meters de
grond ingeslagen wordt. Bij grote woningbouwblokken komen zelfs
ringleidingen voor die op meerdere plaatsen met een pijp in de grond, dus
met "aarde" verbonden zijn.
 
S

Skybuck

Jan 1, 1970
0
Waar ben je grootgebracht? In Engeland spreken ze nml niet over randaarde,
maar over live (bruine draad), neutral (blauwe draad) and ground
(geel/groene of grijze draad) en hebben ze driepolige stopcontacten en
stekkers.

In Nederland gebruiken we het begrip "randaarde" omdat de aarding aan de
rand van de stekkers en contactdozen zit. De aarddraad van
woonhuisaansluitingen bestaat uit een koperen pijp die enkele meters de
grond ingeslagen wordt. Bij grote woningbouwblokken komen zelfs
ringleidingen voor die op meerdere plaatsen met een pijp in de grond, dus
met "aarde" verbonden zijn.

Is allemaal leuk en aardig maar ik snap er nog geen hol van ?

Ik heb een plastic vloer, is die verbonden met die metalen pijp ?

Of alleen verwarmingen ?

En ook de eletriciteits stopcontacten ?

Wat is er precies verbonden met die pijp die de grond in gaat ?

In mijn stopcontacten zitten maar 2 gaatjes en niet 3.

Dus dat vind ik zo vreemd.

Hoe weet ik nou of mijn computer geaard is of niet ?

Hij staat op het hout ?!

Mensen zeggen, raak de kast van de computer aan, maar heeft dat wel
zin als die niet geaard is ?

Doei,
Skybuck.

P.S.: Ik zal het ook even voor die engels mensen zeggen
 
S

Skybuck

Jan 1, 1970
0
On Jun 1, 3:19?pm, Skybuck The Destroyer


The metal part you are talking about is probably connected to ground.
And discharge through ground should not affect the motherboard.

Yes, a static current flowing in the ground circuit (fault) is not
ideal, but I don't know that it would damage a motherboard directly?
Are you the individual who posted recently that you had (2)
motherboards die? If so, I am wondering if something else isn't
wrong?? How many motherboards would it take? Are you building /
upgrading the PC yourself? Are you using static control measures
while handling the boards and semiconductors?

Just a few thoughts to ponder. mpm

I don't think my computer is grounded.

It's on a wooden table.

The outlets only have 2 holes not 3.

Suppose I am correct and my PC is not grounded, then the tips of you
or maybe others are useless:

Touching the computer case does not allows get rid of static
electricy, so it's unreliable advice.

That's just my point I wanna make ;)

I need something reliable or nothing at all... because half-half I
don't like that all ;)

Thanks to all anyway,
Bye,
Skybuck.
 
S

Skybuck

Jan 1, 1970
0
Dat is intussen wel duidelijk geworden!

JK- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Dat geldt nog meer voor jou, jij hebt helemaal niks interessant te
melden, maar vooruit je doet mee voor spek en bonen :)

Doei,
Skybuck.
 
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