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W

WhySoSerious?

Jan 1, 1970
0
I do not much like excessive X-rays myself,so I would be opting for the
alternative method, Bur I would much rather the idiots perfect a sniffer
setup.

Then, you could put 25 people in a room and sniff it, and if it is OK,
they go thru standard security. If the sniffer goes off, Houston has a
problem.

The X-ray thing is too invasive. Not so much the hardware being used,
but the piggery behind it. The problem is with the 'baseline' pig model.

They need to go back to baseline peace officer, which hasn't been seen
in over half a century.

The answer is to get rid of the pigs that declare themselves so
honorable, and smart, when it is quite clear that they are not. Their
mindset has been off for decades. Stop buying new pig cars every other
year and buy some damned sniffer technology!

Hell, put a dog in front of the sampler hose. Do a room full at a time.
No smell, no worry.

Back to the metal detector for the rest. Don't fail that.
 
M

Martin Brown

Jan 1, 1970
0
I do not much like excessive X-rays myself,so I would be opting for the
alternative method, Bur I would much rather the idiots perfect a sniffer
setup.

They are not using X-rays on people!

At least not in the civilised world! The scanners are at microwave or
terahertz wavelength and are pretty impressive in terms of seeing small
concealed items. They saw my credit card in a pocket with no trouble.
The guy running the scanner is in a control room away from the machine
and unless he gets off on cylindrical projections of people he isn't
really looking at a recognisable nude image. The guy at the gate is
connected by earphone to the remote viewer and very accurately asks to
see whatever is being concealed. The kit is very expensive.
Then, you could put 25 people in a room and sniff it, and if it is OK,
they go thru standard security. If the sniffer goes off, Houston has a
problem.

The main explosive threat has far too low a vapour pressure for this to
work. The terrorists are ahead of us on this one - that is why they have
closed potential loopholes for carry-on as far as possible.
The X-ray thing is too invasive. Not so much the hardware being used,
but the piggery behind it. The problem is with the 'baseline' pig model.

The what? US airport security has always been staffed by a bunch of ill
educated thugs and morons - that was what made 9/11 so easy. You had
most of the right gear but didn't bother to train them how to use it.
Immediately post 9/11 the contrast between US airport "security" which
was all bluff and bluster and competent UK security was very evident.

Part of the theatre in US airport "security" is completely bogus and is
just inconvenience without any substantial benefit. But it was done to
placate a paranoid public that was running scared and not flying at all
post 9/11. TSA is crap, but then so were the myopic drudges working for
private contractors that they replaced or supplemented.

Threat objects getting through has increased slightly in the USA even
though civility is much worse. And if you think it is bad as a US
citizen try travelling there with a foreign passport.

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2004/04/26/airport_security_failures/
They need to go back to baseline peace officer, which hasn't been seen
in over half a century.

It is called policing by consent. We still have it in the UK and it
works pretty well. Airport security at Heathrow pulls Merkins with
rounds of live ammo in their jacket pocket and knives in carryon bags.
Our police are polite and the scanners do their job very well. It
doesn't even make the news any more. Here's one from a while back:

http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/Sky-News-Archive/Article/20080641119227
The answer is to get rid of the pigs that declare themselves so
honorable, and smart, when it is quite clear that they are not. Their
mindset has been off for decades. Stop buying new pig cars every other
year and buy some damned sniffer technology!

Hell, put a dog in front of the sampler hose. Do a room full at a time.
No smell, no worry.

Unfortunately that is not true. The terrorists explosive of choice has a
very low vapour pressure so you have to do a swab test. And it looks
like the toner cartridge bomb was clean room work hermetically sealed -
the first test of the UK one did not detect any trace of explosives.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-11664412
Back to the metal detector for the rest. Don't fail that.

They are a bit of a joke too. Taking belts off is another bogus
requirement most scanners will ignore a few tens of grams of metal.

This is not the case at gold refineries where the scanners and your path
through them are designed to measure the weight of mercury amalgam
fillings in your teeth to a fraction of a gram going in and coming out.

Regards,
Martin Brown
 
T

TheGlimmerMan

Jan 1, 1970
0
The what? US airport security has always been staffed by a bunch of ill
educated thugs and morons

That describes all cops. Regardless of what they would like you to
think.
 
T

TheGlimmerMan

Jan 1, 1970
0
They are a bit of a joke too.

Actually, their setup is the joke.
Taking belts off is another bogus
requirement most scanners will ignore a few tens of grams of metal.

No, they do not "ignore it". The operator does, and the alarm
threshold setting does. But it does not have to. They can detect a paper
clip.


That isn't very bright.
I have slugs of epoxy that are heavy because they are silver filled.
They would make great "bullets".

They do not get detected. I know.
 
T

TheGlimmerMan

Jan 1, 1970
0
I have two stainless steel screws in my left leg. The only place they
have ever been detected was in a Federal Court House on my way back
from lunch on a jury duty day. They were not detected in the morning
when I went in.


Again, there is a difference between what is detected, detectable, and
how the machine is set-up. They calibrate it for a certain amount of
'leniency'.

A metal detector can detect a bottle cap six feet away from it, so you
can bet that the LOOP that you travel INSIDE OF can detect ANY metal that
you have. The threshold has to be set higher than that though.

Modern scanners have lights on them that tell the COPerator what area of
the body the metal is located near. They have been around for well over
a decade now. Before 911.

It is just like traffic lights and the threshold for the presence of a
bicycle or motorcycle. Some lights are set to low and a car will set
them off, but a bike will not. Those are set AT the traffic controller.

There are issues in rainy states, and in states where it rains little...
when it does rain.

The technology has been around since the early seventies. They need to
upgrade our traffic control system. Just think of the thousands of jobs
it would create.

Think of all the coal the transition from incandescent to LED lamps
that would be saved.

I have answers for this nation.

All you fucks do is stand around and looky here and looky there and
make guesses at things. I have been watching these problems for decades.
I have been watching this nation since before the Chicago riots.

I am still waiting for the idiots in charge that claim to be so
intelligent, to ever get even one goddamned thing right. 40 fucking
years of watching, and I see every idiot out there acting dumber than
Nancy Grace.

Wake the **** up, America!
 
T

TheGlimmerMan

Jan 1, 1970
0
Fortunately, their nail-clippers were intercepted and destroyed,
before they could pose any threat.


There are plastic bread knives at the grocery that I would not mess
with. The motherfuckers will lay you open!

That doesn't even mention ceramic blades.

And are these guys so dumb that they think just because a laptop works,
it is "safe"?

If all it takes is a few grams of this stuff, then it could easily be
incorporated into a working piece of gear. Hell, an electric toothbrush
would get thru, I'll bet!

They have a battery, and they have an inductive charging coil in them
too!

There are a lot of things that should get banned, scanned, or
otherwise. The most important thing to scan would be FUCKERS' NAMES!

**** calling it "racial" profiling. It IS profiling, but it is
INDIVIDUAL, WHO THE FUCJK ARE YOU profiling. THAT is what it should be.

The airlines should have "Go fly with someone else" lists. It is THEIR
prerogative as to who they want to allow to fly on their planes, no
different than an eatery refusing service.

**** terrorists. **** ALL terrorists! Grind them up into shark food
for the shark filled moat around the prison for the ones we haven't
ground up yet!
 
C

Clifford Heath

Jan 1, 1970
0
TheGlimmerMan said:
There are plastic bread knives at the grocery that I would not mess
with. The motherfuckers will lay you open!

Then again, the value of a knife isn't what it will cut,
but whether the victim *thinks* it will cut. A plastic
knife risks laughter, however sharp it is.

To what extent did the 9/11 terrorists actually *use* the boxcutters?
 
C

Chieftain of the Carpet Crawlers

Jan 1, 1970
0
He's lonely this week. No one will talk to him since he went off his meds.


More like a gnat.


Said one circus flea to the other.

Bwuahahahahhaa!
 
T

TheGlimmerMan

Jan 1, 1970
0
To what extent did the 9/11 terrorists actually *use* the boxcutters?

I am quite certain that all cockpit crew were slaughtered.

You're an idiot if you think they didn't

There were stabbings of passengers as well on the flight that was
thwarted. There were also full on folding pocket knives, not just box
cutters.

Have you even watch a single documentary on the events?

Or are you Rosie O'Retard's little brother?
 
M

Martin Brown

Jan 1, 1970
0
Recently, I went through airport security with a diet coke.

No you didn't and for once I agree with the security guys.
I purchase the diet coke from a vending machine within sight of the x-
ray machine and the TSA agents.
I think they saw me do it.

The stuff that is airside is subject to additional checks. They only
have your word for it that the can you present is the one you just got
from the machine and not a swap for one full of liquid explosive.
For all I know, they get their own sodas out of this same machine. (?)

However, sure enough, they would not let me take it past the check
point.
I said "Hey, I just bought this out the machine right over there."

Their response: You can either drink it now, or put it in the trash,
but you can't take it to the gate."

Which is fair enough. Australia do the same thing for fruit too.
Do you have soda machine at the gate, I asked?
And what's the difference between the soda I purchased right over
there, from one I might get at the gate?
They're both in the same airport.

Their response: We've screened all the sodas at the gate.

Yeah, right. Total bullshit, as usual.

For once they are or at least should be telling the truth. Everything
that goes airside now is meant to be security cleared or trusted source.
So I guess the lessons learned here are:
1) Don't try to take liquids through the checkpoint. (Which,
actually, I did know already, but wasn't thinking - and was more
concerned about the possibility that they might only have Pepsi at the
gate, and I'm more of a Diet Coke fan.)

You learn very slowly. This has been the rule for nearly 4 years now.
2) If you're a dedicated terrorist, the coke machines nearest to the
x-ray scanners, but still on the terminal side of the building, are
apparently ideal places to pack high explosives since the TSA
apparently only checks cokes at the gate.

Idiot. You do a switch between obviously buying the thing and going
through the gate. This is a classic sleight of hand switch deception. If
I wanted to breach airside security I would do something else but that
is another matter and I don't want to help the terrorists.
3) How many times has my situation happened, and yet they don't move
the damn vending machine?, or at least post a small reminder notice on
it?
Why entice folks by putting it right next to the security lines? I
guess TSA agents got to get their jollys somehow?

The lines can be long at times and you can easily drink one in the time
you spend waiting in line. A notice on the machine to remind people with
zero attention span about the rules might be a good idea though.
4) Lesson #4: The focus in on air transportation because those in
charge of our security have no imagination.

Actually I think they are on the money on this one. Either you open it
and drink it there or you junk it. Your mistake! The rules on liquids
being taken airside are *VERY* clear and have been for over 4 years.

Regards,
Martin Brown
 
M

Martin Brown

Jan 1, 1970
0
I stand corrected. I wasn't aware of that system deployed in the US.
However, it is back scatter Xray imaging and the dose is negligible
compared to the cosmic rays from an hours flight. If the manufacturers
spec is right the dose for an Xray backscatter image scan at 0.05uSv is
roughly the same as an extra minute of high altitude flight.
That's not a very flattering picture--a technology that burns right
through all a woman's wiles, then lays them bare, on display.

What is surprising is that it is presented as an image like that. The
scanners I have seen measure a cylindrical projection of the body.

High end far infrared imagers were able to do it a long time ago.

Regards,
Martin Brown
 
T

TheGlimmerMan

Jan 1, 1970
0
Wait!! There's someone out there dumber than Nancy Grace?

I agree. Folks in charge of security have no imagination.
I guarantee you domestic air transportation can be brought to a
screeching halt (at least temporarily) with barely a few days
preparation.
Thankfully, I'm not the kind of person to engage in stuff like that -
but with the right mindset, it should't prove too difficult.

And since it can be done without ever entering the airport, all this
focus on backscatter full-body scanners and TSA pat downs truly
borders on the absurd.

But hey, if the traveling public sheep need to feel safe, I say we
spend a fucking fortune on it and waste our time!
Meanwhile, AlQueada can go attack our water supply, or pack some
pathogen in an overseas container, or whatever. Where's the focus on
that?

I submitted white papers on sealing up ALL overseas transport
containers with RFID seals, and that way any breaches can be spotted, and
exactly where the breach occurred can be localized and determined.

It also has the added advantage of keeping out all illegal live
emigrants, and forces that EVERY container get looked at AS IT gets
sealed. The doors get sealed, the air gets evacuated (replaced), and the
corner seals get installed.

When the container gets here, the lift device (crane) that picks them
up breaks the seals, verifies their integrity, and sniffs the entire
container. The dead air in the container will contain traces of ANYTHING
inside the container in enough ppm to get found out.

I sent these ideas in nearly ten years ago. It was one of my first
design ideas post 9/11.

They are too dumb to do things right in this country any more because
they are all filled up with brainless, Chicago riot mentality, (Nixon
Hoodlum) pig mentality retards, and it has gotten to the point where
nearly anyone in public office is that way. Dumb and dumber.

Three quarters of the piggery in this nation should be fucking street
sweepers, and three quarters of the fucktards that run the government
infrastructure and three quarters of the asswipes in city councils that
budget it all out. They are all absolute fucking idiots. They certainly
do not deserve to own houses or have incomes that allow such ownership.
They have spent the last fifty years fucking the remaining citizenry out
of their ability to afford houses.

What was that famous quote about lawyers and politicians?

The Tea Party Nay Sayers (the idiots *in office* that call the Tea
Party violent and other things) are proof that the dopes we elect care
not one goddamned iota for their constituents.

WAKE UP AMERICA!
 
T

TheGlimmerMan

Jan 1, 1970
0
Anyway, - DO YOU HONESTLY THINK THEY CHECK EVERYTHING AIRSIDE??
I highly doubt it. Maybe a spot check here and there by some
underpaid no-nothing. Or, (more likley?) they might rely on an
administrative paper trail to substitute for "real" security.


You're an idiot. The items are checked out at the dock, before they get
*hand trucked* into an area, where the vending machine stuffing gets
monitored. Any time a cavity like that is opened that is normally
locked, the tasks being done get monitored. So, it all depends of the
hierarchy in place in a given city as to whether the airport runs the
vending machines, or an outside vendor/distributor agreement is in place.
But the procedure changes very little.

So, the machine loading and the cash pan recovery are all tasks that
would be "with escort" tasks and the actual task itself would be
monitored, regardless of who owns or runs the machines.

So, your mentality is what has you drawing incorrect conclusions about
what they do or do not do "airside".

Shop owners get put through security, just like anyone else, except
that eventually, they are in a TSA agent's "known personnel" memory
cache. Their store stock gets put through a security screening at the
incoming loading dock for the airport, and the stores are all subject to
search at any time.

You apparently do not know anything about how secured areas get
operated, with or without a staff of uniformed personnel on hand to
facilitate certain tasks.
 
T

TheGlimmerMan

Jan 1, 1970
0
And hello! A bottle of Diet Coke is a dark brown colored liquid.
What?, Do you honestly think they open every bottle and take a swig?
It's absurd.
And I'm sure they come on pallets! Easy to hide a rogue bottle in the
middle somewhere.
Or what, they weigh every bottle?


The custody trail for the sodas is a known thing from manufacture
through distribution through delivery.

You act like that is some big deal.

Not many folks out there with the ability to insert something in a
closed soda can. Even if one could get raw cans and bare tops to crimp
on, the crimp machinery takes up football fields of space, and there are
no home versions.

Soda distributor delivery truck drivers are all bonded and vetted. That
has been for decades. Where have you been?
 
T

TheGlimmerMan

Jan 1, 1970
0
What about the guy who fixes the vending machines? He's got a truck,
right? Do you think the TSA agents check everything on that truck?
Answer = NO.

Broken vending machines get replaced on site and get repaired off site.

Especially in such a setting.
 
T

TheGlimmerMan

Jan 1, 1970
0
You want to know how much of my "stuff" the TSA agents (and airport
security - which is a different set of folks) went through before
granting me access to all the non-public areas?
Answer = NONE.

Except now it appears that you are too brainless to know why *you* were
not overtly scrutinized. Much less why there is no such need as well.

Are you carrying things onto aircraft over your wireless connections,
idiot?

Are you passing anything to a passenger destined for air travel with
your wireless gear?

Jeez, dude, you are fucking lost as to why something does or does not
get done.
 
T

TheGlimmerMan

Jan 1, 1970
0
Although, they did provide an escort, much to their credit. (Which I
think had more to do with not knowing the layout of the place, more
that is was truly about security).

More stupidity. ALL idiots like you and even those of us that are
smart enough to know what is going on, gets escorted into secured areas
when certain functions are required within the secured area.

When you are in a secured lab, and all cameras, and cell phones and
audio recording devices, etc. are banned, and you need the local
electrical crew to add in a new 40 Amp drop for your new ten rack project
are needed, they have to get scrutinized before they can enter the lab,
and be escorted and monitored the entire time they are in the lab.

Granted, we have contracts with our electrical installer/contractor of
choice where they send us already previously bonded and vetted personnel,
but most of their staff is anyway.

There are protocols for entering a secured area. There are protocols for
being IN a secured area.

ALL personnel are known at ALL times, and if you are NOT a standard
entity, your presence will get treated according to what you are there
for.

You are not very bright to make posts where it is obvious that you do
not proofread your own crap before you post it.
 
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