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External Relay Control on GEM-P816

Does anyone know what system events I can use to control external
relays on the GEM-P816? I can't find a list in any of the
documentation I found.
 
J

Jim

Jan 1, 1970
0
Does anyone know what system events I can use to control external
relays on the GEM-P816? I can't find a list in any of the
documentation I found.

As far as I can determine, it isn't compatable with the relay module.
As I said in an early post, I'm pretty sure that the panel has to have
relay control to be compatable with the X10 module. Unless there's a
revision out on the P816 that I'm not aware of, it does not have relay
control capability. You'll have to upgrade to at least the P1632,
which only has minimal options. The 9600 is the preferred panel for
the best choices of relay/X10 control.
 
As far as I can determine, it isn't compatable with the relay module.
As I said in an early post, I'm pretty sure that the panel has to have
relay control to be compatable with the X10 module. Unless there's a
revision out on the P816 that I'm not aware of, it does not have relay
control capability. You'll have to upgrade to at least the P1632,
which only has minimal options. The 9600 is the preferred panel for
the best choices of relay/X10 control.

Thanks Jim. I have confirmed that I have version 10 of the firmware
which definitely supports the GEM-X10 module, and thus provides
external relay control. I guess nobody really knows exactly how
granular the external relay control is on the GEM-P816 provides since
support for external relay control (or at least GEM-X10 support) is
relatively new for the GEM-P816 (2004). This is probably because most
people doing what I'm trying to accomplish are using higher-end alarm
panels.

In order for me not to have to touch the alarm panel (to avoid dealing
with the alarm monitoring company), I would ideally like to use the
GEM-X10 module to translate as many granular events as possible into
X10 signals (hopefully these events will include at least an open/
close on each individual zone, system armed/disarmed, alarm sounding,
fire alert, etc). I'll then be sending a unique X10 signal for each
event to my Home Controller (PC running X10 compatible software), for
which I can then create any actions (more X10 commands to actually
control things) I want. I should also be able to send an email with
any event received from the GEM-P816. This way, I don't need to touch
the panel to rewire any of the contacts or reprogram like I would if I
upgraded the panel. I believe I will be able to configure up to 64
events to trigger the sending of up to 64 X10 codes (simulating (8) 8-
port external relay modules).

I will advise once I am able to determine if this is all possible. If
anyone has any suggestions or comments as of this point, I would
greatly appreciate it.

Thanks!
Ken
 
R

Robert L Bass

Jan 1, 1970
0
Ken,

I have the Version 10 programming manual. It makes no mention of the GEM-X10 or the relay board. I also have the most current
version of Napco's "Quickloadr" programming software. Under the P816 there is no screen for configuring a GEM-X10, an RB1000 or an
RB1008.

It is possible that something has changed and that I've missed it. Like Jim who is also trying to assist you, I mainly used Napco's
larger panels. However, I spoke to a Napco tech support rep and he said the panel won't support it. One fellow here insists it
will and it is possible he's right. However, I'd strongly advise you to confirm the panel will support it before you buy anything.

I sell Napco to DIYers but I would not offer you the board unless we first confirmed it was going to work. I can confirm that Jim
is correct about relay control. Napco's panels see the GEM-X10 as if it was an external relay board. They won't dim or do "scenes"
but they will turn devices on or off at preset times or upon various conditions and events (alarms, arming, disarming, zone status
changes, trouble conditions, etc.).

I've used Napco's external relay boards to do all sorts of things, including fully automating alarm systems for use in Orthodox
Jewish synagogues, performing basic access control of door locks, etc. You can do a lot with the larger panels. Until we can get
Napco to confirm the P816 is compatible with the GEM-X10 module though, I suggest you hold off on buying one.

--

Regards,
Robert L Bass

=============================>
Bass Home Electronics
941-925-8650
4883 Fallcrest Circle
Sarasota · Florida · 34233
http://www.bassburglaralarms.com
=============================>
 
Ken,

I have the Version 10 programming manual. It makes no mention of the GEM-X10 or the relay board. I also have the most current
version of Napco's "Quickloadr" programming software. Under the P816 there is no screen for configuring a GEM-X10, an RB1000 or an
RB1008.

It is possible that something has changed and that I've missed it. Like Jim who is also trying to assist you, I mainly used Napco's
larger panels. However, I spoke to a Napco tech support rep and he said the panel won't support it. One fellow here insists it
will and it is possible he's right. However, I'd strongly advise you to confirm the panel will support it before you buy anything.

I sell Napco to DIYers but I would not offer you the board unless we first confirmed it was going to work. I can confirm that Jim
is correct about relay control. Napco's panels see the GEM-X10 as if it was an external relay board. They won't dim or do "scenes"
but they will turn devices on or off at preset times or upon various conditions and events (alarms, arming, disarming, zone status
changes, trouble conditions, etc.).

I've used Napco's external relay boards to do all sorts of things, including fully automating alarm systems for use in Orthodox
Jewish synagogues, performing basic access control of door locks, etc. You can do a lot with the larger panels. Until we can get
Napco to confirm the P816 is compatible with the GEM-X10 module though, Isuggest you hold off on buying one.

--

Regards,
Robert L Bass

=============================>
Bass Home Electronics
941-925-8650
4883 Fallcrest Circle
Sarasota · Florida · 34233http://www.bassburglaralarms.com
=============================>








- Show quoted text -

Thanks Robert. You are correct on your first point - it's not listed
in the programming guide for the GEM-P816 (v10). However, it is listed
in the installers guide for the GEM-P816 (v10, WI994C 3/04). On pages
7 and 14, it is explicitly listed as a supported module. My guess is
that they do not reference it in the programming guide since it's to
be treated exactly like an external relay module. Correct me if I'm
wrong, but if it's explicitly listed in the installers guide as a
supported module (written by Napco, who created the GEM-P816), there's
no reason to believe it will not work. Do you disagree?
 
J

Jim

Jan 1, 1970
0
On Mar 21, 8:16?am, [email protected] wrote:
..
Thanks Jim. I have confirmed that I have version 10 of the firmware
which definitely supports the GEM-X10 module, and thus provides
external relay control. I guess nobody really knows exactly how
granular the external relay control is on the GEM-P816 provides since
support for external relay control (or at least GEM-X10 support) is
relatively new for the GEM-P816 (2004). This is probably because most
people doing what I'm trying to accomplish are using higher-end alarm
panels.

In order for me not to have to touch the alarm panel (to avoid dealing
with the alarm monitoring company), I would ideally like to use the
GEM-X10 module to translate as many granular events as possible into
X10 signals (hopefully these events will include at least an open/
close on each individual zone, system armed/disarmed, alarm sounding,
fire alert, etc). I'll then be sending a unique X10 signal for each
event to my Home Controller (PC running X10 compatible software), for
which I can then create any actions (more X10 commands to actually
control things) I want. I should also be able to send an email with
any event received from the GEM-P816. This way, I don't need to touch
the panel to rewire any of the contacts or reprogram like I would if I
upgraded the panel. I believe I will be able to configure up to 64
events to trigger the sending of up to 64 X10 codes (simulating (8) 8-
port external relay modules).

I will advise once I am able to determine if this is all possible. If
anyone has any suggestions or comments as of this point, I would
greatly appreciate it.

Thanks!
Ken

Well If you're looking at the manual and it says you can, all you have
to do is be able to get the PCD program to make the changes. That
would seem to be the only obstacle at this point. Worst case would be
that you have to make the changes via the keypad programing. (ech!)

The other concern that I have is that the panel is not going to allow
you all the options for relay control that you are looking for. I just
can't imagine that they would provide this panel with all the same
relay options that the bigger panels have. You might want to read the
instructions in detail or otherwise determine exactly what you're
going to be able to do. If you're only going to be able to detect an
alarm and not have individual zone sensing, for instance, it might not
be worth your time and expense.
 
I agree. The problem is you have to program
the system to use it. Without programming
instructions we're still in the same boat.
Looking at my copy of the programming
instructions for the P816, I can't find any
reference to the RB1000 or the RB1008.

This is a PITA because without those
instructions we can't make it work. If
you like I can call Napco tech support
again and inquire.

--

Regards,
Robert L Bass

=============================>
Bass Home Electronics
941-925-8650
4883 Fallcrest Circle
Sarasota · Florida · 34233http://www.bassburglaralarms.com
=============================>

Thanks Robert. I guess my next stop is NAPCO technical support. Do you
know if one needs to be a NAPCO dealer in order to call technical
support? If not, I can do the alling so I don't need to bother you.

It would seem strange if they introduced support but then could only
trigger events based on the alarm going off - if that was the case, it
wouldn't differ any from simply hooking one of the X10 modules up to
the bell terminals to trigger an X10 signal when the alarm sounded.

I could be wrong, but I'm hoping not... it's now becoming more of an
exercise in education for me. :)

Thanks,
Ken
 
R

Robert L Bass

Jan 1, 1970
0
Thanks Robert. I guess my next stop is
NAPCO technical support. Do you know
if one needs to be a NAPCO dealer in
order to call technical support? If not,
I can do the calling so I don't need to
bother you.

Napco (like most alarm manufacturers)
won't talk to end users. Their customers
are alarm dealers so they only want to
talk to us. The reason is they can explain
something to someone like me or Jim and
we will service a thousand customers --
or they can explain the same thing to a
thousand users. Their cost of manpower
for tech support would go through the roof
if they suported end users directly. Also,
most alarm manufacturers take the position
that alarm installation and service is for
professionals only. Since I cater to DIYers,
obviously I have a different take on that
subject. :^)
It would seem strange if they introduced
support but then could only trigger events
based on the alarm going off - if that was
the case, it wouldn't differ any from simply
hooking one of the X10 modules up to the
bell terminals to trigger an X10 signal
when the alarm sounded.

True. On the larger panels you have a lot
of options to turn X10 devices on or off.
There's still no dimming capability but
for most folks that's not essential to
alarm integration.

--

Regards,
Robert L Bass

=============================>
Bass Home Electronics
941-925-8650
4883 Fallcrest Circle
Sarasota · Florida · 34233
http://www.bassburglaralarms.com
=============================>
 
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