Florescent light bulbs?

[Don Klipstein]

Halogens are more (about 3x more) efficient than standard tungsten
bulbs, so the room should be cooler. The fixtures can get hot
though. The halogens in standard bulb envelopes aren't hotter than
the standard bulbs.

Halogens are 3x as efficient as some particularly inefficient
non-halogen incandescents, but are generally more efficient than
non-halogen incandescents by a much smaller margin.

When design voltage, wattage and life expactancy are equal, a halogen
usually produces 15-30% more light than a non-halogen (although data I
mention below includes an extreme of a 64% improvement).
When the halogen has life expectancy 2-3 times that of the non-halogen
incandescent of same wattage and voltage, the halogen has light output
usually improved by a smaller margin, sometimes not at all.

Data points:

Design voltage 120V wattage 60 watts:

Non-halogen designed for life expectancy 100 hours: 845-890 lumens
Non-halogen 60A/99, design life expectancy 2500 hours: 790 lumens
Non-hal. rough/industrial service, life 3500 hours: 585 lumens
(Part of the loss is from increased heat conduction from the
longer and more-gas-cooled, and multi-supported filament)

Philips Halogena, design life expectancy 3000 hours: 840-900 lumens
Sylvania Capsylite, average rated life 3000 hours: 960 lumens

Design voltage 120V wattage 100 watts:

Non-halogen designed to average 750 hours: 1670-1750 lumens
Non-halogen Philips 100A/99, designed to average 2500 hours: 1500 lumens
Non-halogen industrial service designed to last 3500 hours: 1175 lumens

Sylvania Capsylite (halogen): 1800-1880 lumens depending on when
you checked
Philips Halogena: 1670 lumens with 3000 hour life expectancy

Design voltage 120V wattage 300 watts:

GE incandescent of life expectancy 750 hours: 6200 lumens
Philips incandescent of life expectancy 750 hours: 6250-6300 lumens
Philips incandescent of life expectancy 2500 hours: 5060 lumens

Philips version of the usual 300W torchiere halogen: 6000 lumens

Design voltage in the 12V ballpark, wattage in the 10-27 watt range:

Type 93 12.8V 1.04 amp incandescent, design life 700 hours: 14 lumens/watt
(mean spherical candlepower 15)
Type 1156 12.8V 2.1 amp incandescent design life 1200 hours: 15 lumens/watt
(mean spherical candlepower 32)

10W 12V T3 bipin halogens: 150 lumens, 15 lumens per watt
20W 12V T3 bipin halogens: 350 lumens, 17.5 lumens per watt

- Don Klipstein ([email protected])

 

[joseph2k]

Is this a recessed ceiling fixture? Those build up heat and are hard on
compact fluorescents. For that matter, some compact fluorescents brag
about being specifically rated to use in recessed ceiling fixtures. Such
includes the 15, 20 and non-dimmable 23 watt ones of Philips SLS series.
Philips did say that the 25 and the dimmable 23 are not rated for use in
recessed ceiling fixtures.


I can say where and when compact fluorescents appear to me prone to
short life:

1) When on-time is short. As I hear it, "standard conditions" for life
expectancy include 3 hours per start. So I expect a fair chance of short
life expectancy compared to incandescents in motion sensor lights,
closets, restrooms used mainly for short trips, and refrigerators.

The presumed 3 hours on per start is real: for old time starter based
fluorescents (1940's vintage); about 30 minutes per start for early "rapid
start" types. CFL lamps do not have the same issues.

 

[[email protected]]

Halogens are more (about 3x more) efficient than standard tungsten
bulbs, so the room should be cooler. The fixtures can get hot
though. The halogens in standard bulb envelopes aren't hotter than
the standard bulbs.

I don't which part got hot. I just know that my head could
feel the heat. It was about 4' away. My father has a life-long
habit of draping the curtains up over the lampshade so he
can see outside. My parents should not be allowed to play
with halogen lamps.

/BAH

 

[Rich Grise]

I don't which part got hot. I just know that my head could
feel the heat. It was about 4' away. My father has a life-long
habit of draping the curtains up over the lampshade so he
can see outside. My parents should not be allowed to play
with halogen lamps.

Maybe for Xmas you could get him one of those pull cord things,
so he could just open them. ;-)

Cheers!
Rich

 

[[email protected]]

Maybe for Xmas you could get him one of those pull cord things,
so he could just open them. ;-)

I should have been more specific. These are the sheers that he
flips up. I already gave them their present, medical insurance.

/BAH

 

[Michael A. Terrell]

Make sure you MISS the movie about the Marshall University football
team killed in a plane crash in 1970.

(My home town.)

How can you make a movie about a plane full of jocks, flown by
Southern Airlines pilots who'd never landed at Huntington before?

They flew into the side of the mountain, forgetting that the airport
was on top ;-)

"Attack of the Killer Tomatoes!" was more interesting ;-)

Well, the tomatoes WERE better actors, after all. That is, before
they hit the sauce, of course. ;-)


--
Service to my country? Been there, Done that, and I've got my DD214 to
prove it.
Member of DAV #85.

Michael A. Terrell
Central Florida

 

[Richard Henry]

"Attack of the Killer Tomatoes!" was more interesting ;-)

That movie was produced by Steve Peace, whose later big production
(California Electricity Deregulation Act, written while he was a member
of the California Senate) was much more of a horror show, without any
(intentional) redeeming comedy.

 

[Rich Grise]

Well, the tomatoes WERE better actors, after all. That is, before
they hit the sauce, of course. ;-)

Oh, GROAN! ;-)

I had a GF once, and when I rented "Amazon Women on the Moon" for movie
night, she had a snit fit because she assumed it was some kind of porno.

Women! Can't live with them, pass the beer nuts. ;-)

Cheers!
Rich

 

[RST Engineering \(jw\)]

Only two, but I'll be damned if I know how they both got into that light
bulb.

{;-)

Jim



So the answer to the most important question

 

[RST Engineering \(jw\)]

Question, what's the difference between beer nuts and deer nuts?

Jim

 

[Zak]

Halogens are more (about 3x more) efficient than standard tungsten
bulbs, so the room should be cooler. The fixtures can get hot
though. The halogens in standard bulb envelopes aren't hotter than
the standard bulbs.

Normal incandescent: 100 w, 1200 lm
Incandescent Krypton: 100 w, 1420 lm = 18% better
Halogen 100 watt high voltage, 1470 lm = 22% better
(high voltage halogen has mostly whiter light and longer life, no big
efficiency gain though the smaller bulbs make for tiny reflectors)
Halogen 100 watt 24 volt, 2200 lm (needs transformer) = 83% better
Halogen infrared reflecting, 12 volt 65 w, 1700 lm (1700/.65 = 2615) =
118% better
(now we're talking, and if it was a 100 watt bulb it would do even
better, but we have transformer loss)
CFL, open tube model, 24 watt, 1500 lm (6250 lm extrapolated to 100
watt) = 420 % better. But the large size makes reflectors and fixtures
less efficient.
MH HID lamp, HCI-T 70 W, 7000 lm (10000 lm extrapolated to 100 watt,
excludes ballast) The winner, being 480% better. But starts slowly. Wish
they were easily available.

Conclusion: halogen looks nice but doesn't save a lot, unless it is the
low voltage infrared reflecting type.




Thomas

 

[John Fields]

Normal incandescent: 100 w, 1200 lm
Incandescent Krypton: 100 w, 1420 lm = 18% better
Halogen 100 watt high voltage, 1470 lm = 22% better
(high voltage halogen has mostly whiter light and longer life, no big
efficiency gain though the smaller bulbs make for tiny reflectors)
Halogen 100 watt 24 volt, 2200 lm (needs transformer) = 83% better
Halogen infrared reflecting, 12 volt 65 w, 1700 lm (1700/.65 = 2615) =
118% better
(now we're talking, and if it was a 100 watt bulb it would do even
better, but we have transformer loss)
CFL, open tube model, 24 watt, 1500 lm (6250 lm extrapolated to 100
watt) = 420 % better. But the large size makes reflectors and fixtures
less efficient.
MH HID lamp, HCI-T 70 W, 7000 lm (10000 lm extrapolated to 100 watt,
excludes ballast) The winner, being 480% better. But starts slowly. Wish
they were easily available.

Conclusion: halogen looks nice but doesn't save a lot, unless it is the
low voltage infrared reflecting type.

 

[redbelly]

Normal incandescent: 100 w, 1200 lm

They're more like 1600-1750 lm, so the relative efficiency of other
bulb types gets even worse.

http://www.lampsplus.com/products/9...06&cm_mmc=MSN-SH-_-Bulb-_-Light Bulbs-_-90306
http://www.lampsplus.com/products/9...10&cm_mmc=MSN-SH-_-Bulb-_-Light Bulbs-_-90410

Mark

 

[Zak]

They're more like 1600-1750 lm, so the relative efficiency of other
bulb types gets even worse.

Hmm, I have my data from Osram for 230 volt bulbs. That may make a
difference.


Thomas

 

[Don Klipstein]

They're more like 1600-1750 lm, so the relative efficiency of other
bulb types gets even worse.

He may be talking about some longlife and/or industrial service ones or
reflectorized ones or 240V ones.

The USA-usual 120V 100W "standard" 100A19 with 750 hour life expectancy
does indeed have rated light output of 1710 lumens or close to that. All
the other 100 watt incandescents of the kinds that I just mentioned do
indeed produce less.

Sylvania's 100W 120V "Capsylite" halogen produces 1800 lumens last time
I checked.

- Don Klipstein ([email protected])

 

[Don Klipstein]

Hmm, I have my data from Osram for 230 volt bulbs. That may make a
difference.

Yes that does make a difference, and does so in two ways:

1) The 240V filament is longer and thinner. for same life expectancy,
it has to be operated at a slightly lower temperature.

2) When comparing two gas-filled incandescents of the same wattage but
different filament lengths, the longer filament will be narrower. Also
narrower will be the region of hot gas surrounding the filament. This
increases the temperature gradient within the region of gas surrounding
the filament, and that increases the amount of heat conducted from the
filament per unit filament area. This heat conducted from the filament is
a loss - it does not become thermal radiation from the filament.

For that matter, a 12 volt 100W incandescent is more efficient than a
120 volt 100W incandescent of similar life expectancy. But even lower
voltage 100W incandescents will be less efficient than 12 volt ones - the
temperature gradient in the ends of a short wide filament will cause
significant heat conduction loss through the ends of the filament.

- Don Klipstein ([email protected])