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Homemade cat5 cable using existing phone line fails.

S

Sam Nickaby

Jan 1, 1970
0
I made my own Ethernet cable to extend our DSL connections to
25 feet. I used a cat5 male connector on each end. I use two ordinary
phone line cords. After I lined them up identically like what cat5 cables
are supposed to I then solder and assemble the cords. I then check the
resistance on all eight terminals. They all check fine.

The problem is when I plug one end of the cable to DSL modem the other
to the PC the cable fails to work. I keep getting "network cable unplug" and
"network cable plug" consistently until I unplug the cable. Does this
mean that the cat5 won't accept the ordinary phone cables?

Thanks
 
D

David Schwartz

Jan 1, 1970
0
I made my own Ethernet cable to extend our DSL connections to
25 feet. I used a cat5 male connector on each end. I use two ordinary
phone line cords. After I lined them up identically like what cat5 cables
are supposed to I then solder and assemble the cords. I then check the
resistance on all eight terminals. They all check fine.

The problem is when I plug one end of the cable to DSL modem the other
to the PC the cable fails to work. I keep getting "network cable unplug"
and
"network cable plug" consistently until I unplug the cable. Does this
mean that the cat5 won't accept the ordinary phone cables?

Thanks

To make a cat patch cord, you need to use cat 5 cable.

DS
 
P

Peter Kolbe

Jan 1, 1970
0
Pins 1 and 2 must be on one twisted pair
Pins 3 and 6 must be on another twisted pair

If you do not have pairs that are twisted together all the way through the
cable, then you cannot use it.

If they are not grouped specifically on the pairs, then there will be
crosstalk, etc.

Peter
 
R

Robert Redelmeier

Jan 1, 1970
0
In comp.dcom.cabling Sam Nickaby said:
I use two ordinary phone line cords.

This is usually flat silver satin. No-where close to Cat5.
Strictly speaking, Cat5 describes an end-to-end link quality
that should be certified. When components are marked "Cat5",
it means that the mfr believes that they can be used to make a
link that will pass Cat5 testing _iff_ you do everything right.

After I lined them up identically like what cat5 cables are
supposed to I then solder and assemble the cords. I then check
the resistance on all eight terminals. They all check fine.

Low resistance straight thru is not enough. Ethernet uses
differential signals which must travel on balanced twisted pairs
to avoid corruption. Electrons may be color blind, but they know
who their dance [twist] partners are.

-- Robert
 
R

Roy

Jan 1, 1970
0
Sam said:
I made my own Ethernet cable to extend our DSL connections to
25 feet. I used a cat5 male connector on each end. I use two ordinary
phone line cords. After I lined them up identically like what cat5 cables
are supposed to I then solder and assemble the cords. I then check the
resistance on all eight terminals. They all check fine.

The problem is when I plug one end of the cable to DSL modem the other
to the PC the cable fails to work. I keep getting "network cable unplug" and
"network cable plug" consistently until I unplug the cable. Does this
mean that the cat5 won't accept the ordinary phone cables?

Thanks


Your cable is not CAT5 since it doesn't have the right number of twists
but then again you don't need CAT5. Your DSL modem probably runs at
10Mbps which calls for CAT3 cable. CAT3 has less twists and most telco
cable meets the criteria. The cable you have may be below that but it
might not matter for a the short run. YMMV

The link light would come on in any case so you have something else
wrong. Your modem may require a cross over cable or you don't have it
wired correctly (pin1 to pin1). You actually only needed two pair 1-2
and 3-6.

Correct that problem and then try your cable. If you don't get errors,
you are just fine

Roy
 
C

Carl Navarro

Jan 1, 1970
0
I made my own Ethernet cable to extend our DSL connections to
25 feet. I used a cat5 male connector on each end. I use two ordinary
phone line cords. After I lined them up identically like what cat5 cables
are supposed to I then solder and assemble the cords. I then check the
resistance on all eight terminals. They all check fine.

The problem is when I plug one end of the cable to DSL modem the other
to the PC the cable fails to work. I keep getting "network cable unplug" and
"network cable plug" consistently until I unplug the cable. Does this
mean that the cat5 won't accept the ordinary phone cables?

I'll feed the troll.

You don't want to know what I think you did.

Buy a long patch cord or call a professional or a better amateur.

Carl Navarro
 
P

petrus bitbyter

Jan 1, 1970
0
Sam Nickaby said:
I made my own Ethernet cable to extend our DSL connections to
25 feet. I used a cat5 male connector on each end. I use two ordinary
phone line cords. After I lined them up identically like what cat5 cables
are supposed to I then solder and assemble the cords. I then check the
resistance on all eight terminals. They all check fine.

The problem is when I plug one end of the cable to DSL modem the other
to the PC the cable fails to work. I keep getting "network cable unplug"
and
"network cable plug" consistently until I unplug the cable. Does this
mean that the cat5 won't accept the ordinary phone cables?

Thanks

Did the equipment run when using an original (shorter) cat5 cable? Did you
use the right pairs twisted? The colors of the ordinairy telco cable you
used may differ from the cat5 ones, you know. What about your soldering
skills? You measured for conductivity, did you also check for short circuit?
(BTW, all CAT5 connectors I'm aware of are crimp types, where did you get
these solderable things from? How do they look like?) Where did you get the
information of the cat5 cable? Be aware that real cat5 cable has a higher
quality and price that ordinary telco. The quality of your home industry
product may not be good enough.

petrus bitbyter
 
D

DecaturTxCowboy

Jan 1, 1970
0
At the risk of someone saying this thread is pathetic, I'll post an
answer as there are some good points to consider.

Sam said:
I made my own Ethernet cable to extend our DSL connections to
25 feet.

From what you are describing, it appears you have a simple DSL to
computer hookup. Instead of extending the ethernet connection from the
modem to the computer, why not simply place the modem next to the
computer and extend the silver satin phone line to the modem.
I used a cat5 male connector on each end. I use two ordinary
phone line cords.

As other guys have said, silver satin line cord won't work. Untwisted
cable has no cross-talk immunity.
After I lined them up identically like what cat5 cables
are supposed to I then solder and assemble the cords.

Typically CAT5 ethernet cable are straight-through, but
DSL modem-to-computer cables are usually cross-over.
I keep getting "network cable unplug" and
"network cable plug" consistently until I unplug the cable.

Those error messages usually indicate intermittent loss of copper
continuity, even thought you are showing good continuity when you test
the cables, they may not work when plugged in. My line of thinking is
that you might be using modular plugs designed for solid conductor and
silver satin is stranded wire. Although is more problematic the other
way around - using a stranded wire modular connector with solid wire.

The error message "Local Area Connection is now connected. This
connection has limited or no connectivity" usually means you have an IP
issue, but there can be two reasons for this. You computer's TCP/IP
properties are set for dynamic IP, but your network is static IP *OR*
you simply can't connect due to a cable problem.

You may even get a message saying "Local Area Connection is now
connected. Speed: 100.0 Mbps" when in fact its not working as that
message only indicates you have copper continuity. I've seen this after
someone stapled 50 feet of CAT5 to the baseboard. No error messages, but
it just didn't work..period.

BTW...just for grins, I just made up a 20 foot silver satin cord with
568B modular ends for stranded cable. It said "Local Area Connection is
now connected. Speed: 100.0 Mbps", but I couldn't even ping the two
computers.
Does this
mean that the cat5 won't accept the ordinary phone cables?

Move the modem next to the computer and redo you ends with RJ-11 plugs.
 
R

Rich Grise

Jan 1, 1970
0
I made my own Ethernet cable to extend our DSL connections to
25 feet. I used a cat5 male connector on each end. I use two ordinary
phone line cords. After I lined them up identically like what cat5 cables
are supposed to I then solder and assemble the cords. I then check the
resistance on all eight terminals. They all check fine.

The problem is when I plug one end of the cable to DSL modem the other
to the PC the cable fails to work. I keep getting "network cable unplug" and
"network cable plug" consistently until I unplug the cable. Does this
mean that the cat5 won't accept the ordinary phone cables?

Thanks

I've used cat 3 (ordinary flat telephone extension cable) for a 100' run,
with cat 5 (RJ-45) connectors at each end - but I had to pay attention
to which pins I hooked up:

http://www.ertyu.org/steven_nikkel/ethernetcables.html

I suspect you have a simple miswire, or I don't understand the question.

Good Luck!
Rich
 
D

DecaturTxCowboy

Jan 1, 1970
0
Carl said:
I'll feed the troll.

You don't want to know what I think you did.

Buy a long patch cord or call a professional or a better amateur.

Carl Navarro

Don't feel bad Sam. His posts seem to sarcastic replies indicate HE is
the one that needs to see a professional.
 
D

Doug McIntyre

Jan 1, 1970
0
Rich Grise said:
I've used cat 3 (ordinary flat telephone extension cable) for a 100' run,
with cat 5 (RJ-45) connectors at each end - but I had to pay attention
to which pins I hooked up:

Flat telephone cable (silver satin) isn't Cat-3 cable. It would be
known as voice-grade, rated good for maybe 5kHz. Cat-3 cable is round,
looks just like cat-5 normally, just not as many twists per inch.

It also depends alot on speed too. You can get away with alot for 10-Base-T.
With todays stuff being all 100-Base-TX or 1000-Base-T, the specs are
*alot* tighter.
 
D

Don Bowey

Jan 1, 1970
0
I made my own Ethernet cable to extend our DSL connections to
25 feet. I used a cat5 male connector on each end. I use two ordinary
phone line cords. After I lined them up identically like what cat5 cables
are supposed to I then solder and assemble the cords. I then check the
resistance on all eight terminals. They all check fine.

The problem is when I plug one end of the cable to DSL modem the other
to the PC the cable fails to work. I keep getting "network cable unplug" and
"network cable plug" consistently until I unplug the cable. Does this
mean that the cat5 won't accept the ordinary phone cables?

Thanks

No, it means you have something wrong.

By the way, how many twists per foot did you put in your home-made "Cat 5"
cable?
 
S

Sam Nickaby

Jan 1, 1970
0
Don Bowey said:
No, it means you have something wrong.

By the way, how many twists per foot did you put in your home-made "Cat 5"
cable?

There are no twists.

The DSL modem-to-computer cables I have don't seem to have the
cross-over cable, they are straight-through. I'd took a continuity test
on each terminal and don't seem to find any crossover cable. But the
link light comes up fine on the DSL modem but the link fails to
work. The modular plug I use is made by AT&T model (700A8)
part no. LR85625. The plug is normally designed for a cat5 cable
with no soldering or crimping tools required but its large delta shape
plug makes it possible to solder the telephone wire to the
terminals. I'd also check for short circuits and found none. The
phone wire isn't twisted, that may be problem. I'll have to run down
to the electronics store and get a fresh set of modular plugs and cat5
cables.

The Internet connection works fine once I move the modem closer
the PC using the 5-ft cat5 cable that came with the modem. Since
we have two PC that don't use the Internet the same time, it
makes sense to run a long cable to the other PC and just plug the
cable to the modem. This also a good way to yank the cord once
your kids stays up too late online.

Thanks all
 
B

Ben Jackson

Jan 1, 1970
0
I made my own Ethernet cable to extend our DSL connections to
25 feet. I used a cat5 male connector on each end.

That's an RJ45 connector (the plastic bit that looks like a big phone
plug, which is an RJ11). The connector is about the least important
bit. It's the cable that's classified CAT5.
I use two ordinary
phone line cords. After I lined them up identically like what cat5 cables
are supposed to I then solder and assemble the cords.

I've never seen solder type RJ45 connectors. You need a crimping tool.
For one cable it's not worth it. For many, it is.
I then check the
resistance on all eight terminals. They all check fine.

DC connectivity is fine to check your work if you used the right
materials. If you used ordinary satin (flat) wire then you may find
a connection but it would not work.
The problem is when I plug one end of the cable to DSL modem the other
to the PC the cable fails to work. I keep getting "network cable unplug" and
"network cable plug" consistently until I unplug the cable.

That supports your claim of proper end-to-end wiring, but shows what
happens if you use inferior cable. The link speed negotiation is very
slow compared to data speeds, so the NWAY autonegotiation works and then
the link fails.

Buy some other cable and try again. Use CAT5, or if you're cheap, use
CAT3 as others have suggested. If it's not round, it's not going to
work. You don't need all 4 pairs, only 2 (look at a good ethernet
connector, you need the green and orange pairs). For a daily use cable,
get stranded wire or your cable will be very stiff.
 
S

Sam Nickaby

Jan 1, 1970
0
Ben Jackson said:
That's an RJ45 connector (the plastic bit that looks like a big phone
plug, which is an RJ11). The connector is about the least important
bit. It's the cable that's classified CAT5.

I've never seen solder type RJ45 connectors. You need a crimping tool.
For one cable it's not worth it. For many, it is.

Here's the modular plug I used http://support.avaya.com/edoc/docs/cib/cib28602.pdf

They're not made for soldering but there's enough room to solder the phone
line to the connectors. If the cable had been the correct gauge then soldering
wouldn't be required.
DC connectivity is fine to check your work if you used the right
materials. If you used ordinary satin (flat) wire then you may find
a connection but it would not work.

That supports your claim of proper end-to-end wiring, but shows what
happens if you use inferior cable. The link speed negotiation is very
slow compared to data speeds, so the NWAY autonegotiation works and then
the link fails.

Buy some other cable and try again. Use CAT5, or if you're cheap, use
CAT3 as others have suggested. If it's not round, it's not going to
work. You don't need all 4 pairs, only 2 (look at a good ethernet
connector, you need the green and orange pairs). For a daily use cable,
get stranded wire or your cable will be very stiff.

Thanks. Also, the link light comes up fine on the DSL modem but the link fails to
work on the homemade cable. I will use the right cable.
 
K

Kay Archer

Jan 1, 1970
0
Ben Jackson said:
That's an RJ45 connector (the plastic bit that looks like a big phone
plug, which is an RJ11). The connector is about the least important
bit. It's the cable that's classified CAT5.
Not quite, the connectors (either plug or 110) should also be certifiable.
I've never seen solder type RJ45 connectors. You need a crimping tool.
For one cable it's not worth it. For many, it is.
I'll agree that _occasionally_ making your own patch cable is a necessary
evil (and I have the crimper and a tester). But, punching down a 110 is
much more reliable. Buy reputable patch cables, punch down long runs. And
a punch down tool is cheaper than a good crimping tool.


DC >>connectivity<< is fine to check your work if you used the right
materials. If you used ordinary satin (flat) wire then you may find
a connection but it would not work.
Continuity?



That supports your claim of proper end-to-end wiring, but shows what
happens if you use inferior cable. The link speed negotiation is very
slow compared to data speeds, so the NWAY autonegotiation works and then
the link fails.

Buy some other cable and try again. Use CAT5, or if you're cheap, use
CAT3 as others have suggested. If it's not round, it's not going to
work. You don't need all 4 pairs, only 2 (look at a good ethernet
connector, you need the green and orange pairs). For a daily use cable,
get stranded wire or your cable will be very stiff.
Attenuation goes up with stranded cable...
It is used for patch cables specifically for the flexibility. Again for
long runs use solid cable and punch down at each end. Then plug your patch
cables in at each end.

Depending on where you run your cables, it may be necessary to purchase
plenum grade cable. Check with your local building inspector.

Or hire a pro to install your network. (g).
 
A

Al Dykes

Jan 1, 1970
0
That's an RJ45 connector (the plastic bit that looks like a big phone
plug, which is an RJ11). The connector is about the least important
bit. It's the cable that's classified CAT5.


I've never seen solder type RJ45 connectors. You need a crimping tool.
For one cable it's not worth it. For many, it is.


DC connectivity is fine to check your work if you used the right
materials. If you used ordinary satin (flat) wire then you may find
a connection but it would not work.


That supports your claim of proper end-to-end wiring, but shows what
happens if you use inferior cable. The link speed negotiation is very
slow compared to data speeds, so the NWAY autonegotiation works and then
the link fails.

Buy some other cable and try again. Use CAT5, or if you're cheap, use
CAT3 as others have suggested. If it's not round, it's not going to
work. You don't need all 4 pairs, only 2 (look at a good ethernet
connector, you need the green and orange pairs). For a daily use cable,
get stranded wire or your cable will be very stiff.



Real(tm) Catagory-rated cable ALWAYS has the specification written on
the cable jacket, every couple feet. If it doesnt say CAT-3, CAT5,
CAT-5e, etc. It's not an ethernet cable.
 
A

Al Dykes

Jan 1, 1970
0
Here's the modular plug I used http://support.avaya.com/edoc/docs/cib/cib28602.pdf

They're not made for soldering but there's enough room to solder the phone
line to the connectors. If the cable had been the correct gauge then soldering
wouldn't be required.


Thanks. Also, the link light comes up fine on the DSL modem but the link fails to
work on the homemade cable. I will use the right cable.

I don't think the link light is any better than DC continuity
test. All it says is that there is a wire plugged in.

For you, the worst outcome is that the power-up handshake determines
that the link is capable of 100MB but as soon as the computer tries to
send data at that rate it fails in some way that won't be obvious to
you.

A possible solution for a margional cable is to "nail" the link speed
to 10MB. Your Computer can do this and your DSL gear will probably
follow, properly.

Make the setting 10MB/Half Duplex.

If you *do* get this cable in operation, keep an eye on the error
rates. Netstat is you friend.
 
R

Robert Redelmeier

Jan 1, 1970
0
In comp.dcom.cabling Doug McIntyre said:
Flat telephone cable (silver satin) isn't Cat-3 cable. It
would be known as voice-grade, rated good for maybe
5kHz. Cat-3 cable is round, looks just like cat-5 normally,
just not as many twists per inch.
It also depends alot on speed too. You can get away with
alot for 10-Base-T. With todays stuff being all 100-Base-TX
or 1000-Base-T, the specs are *alot* tighter.

FWIW, I've pushed 10baseT through 50ft of silver satin
without errors. I'm not surprised Rich could make 100ft.
To minimize crosstalk, I used straddled pairs USOC-style.

At 100, the same cable gave nice link-lights, but was
full of errors.

-- Robert
 
P

Panda

Jan 1, 1970
0
Sam,

Normal telephone cables are Cat-3 and you need cat-5 or cat-5e cables
with proper pin assignment when crimping RJ-45 connectors to both ends.

I would rather buy ready made standard Cat-5e cable than buying
crimping tool, RJ-45 connectors and a roll of cable and start a
multi-session operation!

Naim
www.networkingland.com
..
 
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