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How can I test a xlr charging port

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kellys_eye

Jun 25, 2010
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Do any of the charger lights work?

Do they change state if a battery is connected?

As far as you are concerned a charger is a charger is a charger - in other words, with the correct plug fitted you could use ANY charger to charge your scooter. In fact, get an 'ordinary' charger for 24V (they sell them for trucks) and use that in place of the one you have.... a charger of 'Chinese' origin isn't what I'd call decent equipment.......

If you have a set of batteries external to the scooter then have you tried charging them using the Chinese charger? If the charger can charge 'external' batteries then the charger is ok.

Let's establish the charger is ok before we consider the scooter to be at fault.
 

Tracker

Dec 19, 2017
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Do any of the charger lights work?

Do they change state if a battery is connected?

As far as you are concerned a charger is a charger is a charger - in other words, with the correct plug fitted you could use ANY charger to charge your scooter. In fact, get an 'ordinary' charger for 24V (they sell them for trucks) and use that in place of the one you have.... a charger of 'Chinese' origin isn't what I'd call decent equipment.......

If you have a set of batteries external to the scooter then have you tried charging them using the Chinese charger? If the charger can charge 'external' batteries then the charger is ok.

Let's establish the charger is ok before we consider the scooter to be at fault.

Yes, the LED lights work. When charging they are supposed to both be red; when charging is complete the one light turns green. And when charging a cooling fan runs. My LEDs are red and green constantly, the charging light never being red, the fan never running, even though the batteries are not fully charged. This is the second new charger of the same brand tried, both behaving the same. The Chinese charger supplied with the scooter lasted 12 years, and it's hard to find one of these 24V chargers not made in China, at an affordable price. I suspect it's not a charger issue, but I have to know. I have no other external 12V AGM batteries to try it on, and if I did, the XLR plug wouldn't connect to them anyway. I'm not inclined to buy another charger; rather I plan to go to a local scooter store and ask if they will plug up one of their chargers and see if the batteries start charging.

If the charger is good, I'm wondering if I could cut off the XLR plug and attach wires with alligator clips to charge the batteries directly, bypassing the scooter wiring/electronics. Do you think that would work OK?
 

Terry01

Jul 5, 2017
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Sure it does. Check along your battery harness and where it connects into the control unit it'll have a 60 or 80A just before it enters the control unit.

I see you say the scooter moves with the throttle?? If so disregard the fuse comment as it wouldn't go if the fuse was bust.
 

Terry01

Jul 5, 2017
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Your XLR connector on the scooter has 3 holes correct? If it does depending what way it is orientated either the top or bottom hole is the inhibitor hole. The centre 2 are the + and - so if you set your meter to DC and probe the centre holes you should get a reading. This will let you know if everything on the scooter side is ok. Do this and let me know what reading you get.
 

kellys_eye

Jun 25, 2010
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If there's no output from the charger then the charger is faulty.

The charger may have an internal fuse.
 

Terry01

Jul 5, 2017
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It's strange 3 chargers are all not working. Are you using the same wall socket in your home? It sounds like the fuse in the wall socket is bust :)
 

Terry01

Jul 5, 2017
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It's a pity he can't get no one to look at it who is clued up on these things.
 

Tracker

Dec 19, 2017
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Your XLR connector on the scooter has 3 holes correct? If it does depending what way it is orientated either the top or bottom hole is the inhibitor hole. The centre 2 are the + and - so if you set your meter to DC and probe the centre holes you should get a reading. This will let you know if everything on the scooter side is ok. Do this and let me know what reading you get.

This is what my female xlr socket looks like. As far as I have been able to determine, the pin out for the plug is: 1=positive, 2=inhibiter, 3=negative.

For the record, I think I've ruled out all the simple possible problems. The circuit breaker for the wall outlet is not tripped; everything plugged there works, including the lights on the charger. There is no external fuse on the charger (a mute issue, since the charger powers up with lights). There is a 70A thermal circuit breaker on the batteries (not an issue since the scooter does run). There is a Zing Ear 15A charging breaker with a reset button which I've bridged to no effect (and checked for continuity). The disconnected battery cables are getting no flow-through juice from the charger. The connected batteries show no increase of voltage with charger on. And, of course, the XLR port and wiring harness have been replaced.

I really don't know precisely how to check the output from the charger. I assumed perhaps the multimeter probes on xlr pins 1 and 3 would give me a reading of 24V (charger powered on, of course). But I'm getting rapidly changing mV readings. Maybe the charger really is defective. Or, maybe it's in the circuit board. I don't believe the manufacturer is going to come up with electronics parts for this old vehicle. I may be able to find someone locally who can diagnose the problem; whether it can be fixed remains to be seen, I suspect it could be, but at what cost.

If it's going to be too expensive, I would just as soon rig up a charger to charge the batteries directly with alligator clips. I'd like to know if I could wire up a female xlr port with alligator clips attached to the batteries permanently, leaving the female port accessible so I can connect my charger's XLR plug to juice up the batteries as needed.
xlr female.jpg
 

kellys_eye

Jun 25, 2010
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I really don't know precisely how to check the output from the charger. I assumed perhaps the multimeter probes on xlr pins 1 and 3 would give me a reading of 24V
According to the diagram I have, pin 1 is negative and 2 is positive (not 3). These pin numbers reference the connection on your scooter, not the charger. I expect the wiring to the plug form the charger to match this numbering.

If there has been some confusion in the pin numbering and therefore wiring of the plug from the charger then your initial connection has caused a short circuit of the output from the charger and operated whatever short-circuit protection the charger has internally. I'd have thought this protection would be electronic (i.e. self resetting) but you can't discount there may be a fuse in there too.

Either way, the initial error may have simply been repeated when you've used a second charger and they now BOTH have the same fault!

Have a close look at the wiring on the back of the connector in your scooter and see if there are any numbers on the back off it - alternatively hold the plug and socket close to each other and double check that positive actually goes to the BLACK wire and negative to the BLUE (on the scooter socket).

Next, you'll have to take the cover off the battery charger to determine if there is a blown fuse internally.

If you remove the four screws at either end of the metal housing those end plates will be moveable - you might get lucky and find that any fuse is on the immediate edge of the circuit board therefore easily replaced. If you're unlucky you may have to slide the internals out of the casing - and there are probably additional screws along the edges f the box that will require removal.

Post pics of all sides of the charger box before proceeding.
 

Tracker

Dec 19, 2017
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According to the diagram I have, pin 1 is negative and 2 is positive (not 3). These pin numbers reference the connection on your scooter, not the charger. I expect the wiring to the plug form the charger to match this numbering.

If there has been some confusion in the pin numbering and therefore wiring of the plug from the charger then your initial connection has caused a short circuit of the output from the charger and operated whatever short-circuit protection the charger has internally. I'd have thought this protection would be electronic (i.e. self resetting) but you can't discount there may be a fuse in there too.

Either way, the initial error may have simply been repeated when you've used a second charger and they now BOTH have the same fault!

Have a close look at the wiring on the back of the connector in your scooter and see if there are any numbers on the back off it - alternatively hold the plug and socket close to each other and double check that positive actually goes to the BLACK wire and negative to the BLUE (on the scooter socket).

Next, you'll have to take the cover off the battery charger to determine if there is a blown fuse internally.

If you remove the four screws at either end of the metal housing those end plates will be moveable - you might get lucky and find that any fuse is on the immediate edge of the circuit board therefore easily replaced. If you're unlucky you may have to slide the internals out of the casing - and there are probably additional screws along the edges f the box that will require removal.

Post pics of all sides of the charger box before proceeding.

Kellys_eye, the modular connectors of the wires of the XLR port on the scooter are different and can connect only one way (see photo). The wiring of the new port is identical to that of the old one I replaced. The XLR plug of the charger is identical to the one of the old charger and can plug into the port only one way. The charger is specifically designed for charging wheelchair and scooter batteries via XLR connections. The charger power LED lights up, so I don't think it has a blown fuse. Looking at other charging ports sold online, I now believe that pin/socket number 1 is positive (black wire) and 2 is negative (blue wire), same as the wiring of mine. Yes there are numbers on the back of the socket which do match those on the front.

Will have to hook up another charger to see if charging takes place. If not, I will have to either have some electronics diagnostics done or rig up charging directly to the batteries. Thanks again for your help.

IMG_0271.JPG
 

Tracker

Dec 19, 2017
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Your XLR connector on the scooter has 3 holes correct? If it does depending what way it is orientated either the top or bottom hole is the inhibitor hole. The centre 2 are the + and - so if you set your meter to DC and probe the centre holes you should get a reading. This will let you know if everything on the scooter side is ok. Do this and let me know what reading you get.

OK, I checked the voltage in the scooter's XLR sockets 1 (+) and 2 (-) and got 24.7V, same as at the bank of batteries. That's about 70% charged, which matches the scooter's battery level meter's 7 LEDs lit up, after several days on the charger while I've been recuperating from a bout of spinal stenosis pain! It seems to me maybe the charger has been in trickle charge mode all this time without the full charge up mode kicking in (with fan running). The charger's charging indicator LED has remained green all along which normally would be the case after starting out red and turning green only after the batteries reach 100% charge and the charger switches to trickle stage (and fan stops). I'm thinking this is the second consecutive defective charger of this brand I've received. I must get to another charger to see if it will fully charge the batteries.
 

kellys_eye

Jun 25, 2010
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Do you get the same 24.7V on the charger plug when it's NOT plugged into the scooter?

The panel LED on the charger could still be lit even if the OUTPUT was missing due to a blown fuse - the LEDs are part of a prior-operating circuit that indicates the status of charge, not the actual output voltage.
 

Tracker

Dec 19, 2017
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Do you get the same 24.7V on the charger plug when it's NOT plugged into the scooter?

The panel LED on the charger could still be lit even if the OUTPUT was missing due to a blown fuse - the LEDs are part of a prior-operating circuit that indicates the status of charge, not the actual output voltage.

Checked fuse, not blown. Meter reads .2mV at the +/- pins of the powered up charger's XLR plug
 

tedstruk

Jan 7, 2012
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So your breezy died. sad day in Israel.
Heres my take on this. those desert monkeys are trying to charge 24v lead acid batterys with 5A. the only time I know of that you use 5-6 amps to charge a battery is the first 3 minutes on a brand new dead battery with new acid in it. All the rest of the charge is done about .2 of one amp. It takes along time to charge a battery all the way.. sounds like somebody made a cheap fast charging system that failed on you..
sorry I ain't a chair scooter pro. take it to any US auto shop and tell the mechanic to fix it....no big deal..might take some parts...

HINT- everything being new... the problem is probably something like a grounding out...test meter to the + on the battery, and - test on the frame of the machine... any power there is a ground out to the frame on one of the wires.
 

kellys_eye

Jun 25, 2010
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Checked fuse, not blown.
Which fuse and where?

If the charger output is (effectively) 0V the charger is faulty. Since you have two faulty chargers this is either very bad co-incidence (unlikely) cr@p product (possible) or something you did wrongly when first using them (probable).

Either way, can you open one of the chargers and post a pic of the internals?
 

Terry01

Jul 5, 2017
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I agree with k-e.

Also, I know if the charger doesn't see a set value from the batteries when first connected it won't start the charging sequence. Will this affect the result when you probe the XLR plug coming out the charger with a meter?

It's a strange one for sure!
 

Tracker

Dec 19, 2017
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Which fuse and where?

If the charger output is (effectively) 0V the charger is faulty. Since you have two faulty chargers this is either very bad co-incidence (unlikely) cr@p product (possible) or something you did wrongly when first using them (probable).

Either way, can you open one of the chargers and post a pic of the internals?

Not following you. What might I have done wrong? I've owned this scooter 12 years, using the same kind of charger, same connections, same kind of batteries, same wiring. One plugs in the charger to the xlr port and turns on the charger. It charges batteries to 100%, then switches to a trickle charge.
 
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