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need spring-energy-storage mechanism

M

Michael A. Terrell

Jan 1, 1970
0
Revision said:
Yeah, maybe a track... stuff the goods in a ball and roll it down. Or a
catapult.


Don't forget to add enough cats to the load in the "Cat-A-Pult" to
make sure it lands right side up.


--
Service to my country? Been there, Done that, and I've got my DD214 to
prove it.
Member of DAV #85.

Michael A. Terrell
Central Florida
 
H

Homer J Simpson

Jan 1, 1970
0
Start at the beginning. You have a weight on top of a mountain, how
do you get it down the mountain?

Funicular.


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L

lightninglad

Jan 1, 1970
0
i think i need a spring energy-storage mechanism. Maybe a very large
wind-up clock motor?

the scenario is: a slightly-valuable commodity originates at the top
of a mountain. More or less a bushel at a time. there is an existing
paved road. the commodity fetches a price, but not enough to pay for
very much transport.

the concept is to use a cargo bicycle, maybe with trailer, to carry
the items down to the bottom of the mountain, "winding up the clock"
on the spring-storage.

at the bottom, the load is transferred to buyers. the now very-much-
lighter bicycle is to be driven UP the mountain, using the stored
energy.

Any cat which will catch the mice is fine with me. I'm just thinking
that anything involving electricity, hydraulic fluids, etc, will be
too involved, and losses throguh two conversions. Capacitor storage
might be feasible, if there's high quality ones being sold. The charge
doesn't need to held for long amounts of time. Down the hill, then
back up.

Ideally, this will be a ready-to-go or mostly ready-to-go
commercial item. I am rather mechanically/electrically handy. But
this is business, not pleasure. Time spent should be cost-effective.

Use a simple counterweight and brake - the weight of the goods going
down pulls it up and when they're removed, the counterweight falls
back down. No road needed.
Any spring based energy storage device is likely to require an
excessively heavy frame to contain the compressive forces. A flywheel
(vacuum cage ?) will work but once again weight is involved - although
with a rim weighted flywheel it might not be as much as the spring
system.
 
D

default

Jan 1, 1970
0
Yeah, maybe a track... stuff the goods in a ball and roll it down. Or a
catapult.

I like catapult or big slingshot.

Or a pipe, he didn't say what the material is.
 
M

MooseFET

Jan 1, 1970
0
Don't forget to add enough cats to the load in the "Cat-A-Pult" to
make sure it lands right side up.

Tape buttered toast onto the cats back and it will spin up and fly
much straighter.
 
M

me

Jan 1, 1970
0
i think i need a spring energy-storage mechanism. Maybe a very large
wind-up clock motor?
[snip]
the concept is to use a cargo bicycle, maybe with trailer, to carry
the items down to the bottom of the mountain, "winding up the clock"
on the spring-storage.

at the bottom, the load is transferred to buyers. the now very-much-
lighter bicycle is to be driven UP the mountain, using the stored
energy.

Any cat which will catch the mice is fine with me. I'm just thinking
that anything involving electricity, hydraulic fluids, etc, will be
too involved, and losses throguh two conversions. Capacitor storage
might be feasible, if there's high quality ones being sold. The charge
doesn't need to held for long amounts of time. Down the hill, then
back up.


You're up against the energy density problem. You don't quantify
anything here, but you are potentially looking to store a large
quantity of energy. Flywheels make good energy storage "buffers"
much like capacitors, but they don't do large energy storage well.
And they have losses as well. Folks have suggestsed various
forms of cable driven machines, and that has the advantage that
you'll use the energy when you generate it. Alternately, you
can store the energy in a fixed location and resuse it through a
cable system. And cable systems will have their significant losses
as well.

It would seem that what you are after actually is any reasonably
efficient storage system, and then use it to move ALOT of
material. That will increase the difference between the mass
being lifted, and that being lowered. This will allow you to suffer
fairly significant losses an still accomplish what you are after.
This system you envision will work because you plan on harvesting
the potential energy of materials already elevated on the mountian to
do work. So you'll want to harvest large amounts such that you can
stand the losses in the conversion and use.

Off a cliff your easiest way is a 50 lb bucket with a 60 lb
counter
weight all hanging on a single pulley. Fill bucket, it goes down,
weight comes up. Empty bucket, weight goes down, bucket comes up.
You can do something similar with a cable, a car, and a track. Other
than that, my bet would be on any of the existing regenerative braking
systems already in existence.
 
M

Moka Java

Jan 1, 1970
0
While you were siting on you fat pot smoking ass trolling to get other
people to create energy for you I bought 3 bicycles at Wal-Mart, hired a
bunch of Mexicans with back packs and scooped your franchise.

Now go get a job and stop wasting our time and get your fat pimply face
out'a your mom's refrigerator!

R "school's out for the summer" TF
 
R

Rich Grise

Jan 1, 1970
0
Off a cliff your easiest way is a 50 lb bucket with a 60 lb
counter
weight all hanging on a single pulley. Fill bucket, it goes down,
weight comes up. Empty bucket, weight goes down, bucket comes up.
You can do something similar with a cable, a car, and a track. Other
than that, my bet would be on any of the existing regenerative braking
systems already in existence.

Instead of a counterweight, just use two buckets. Fill the top bucket,
release the brake, and the bucket descends, raising the other bucket.
Set the brake, empty the lower bucket while filling the upper bucket,
and so on.

But that depends on the characteristics of the road - is it straight?
Line-of-sight? Can you claim a lane for your cablecars?

I wonder what ever happened to the OP anyway?

Thanks,
Rich
 
M

Michael A. Terrell

Jan 1, 1970
0
MooseFET said:
Tape buttered toast onto the cats back and it will spin up and fly
much straighter.


Well, at least till all the butter flys off.


--
Service to my country? Been there, Done that, and I've got my DD214 to
prove it.
Member of DAV #85.

Michael A. Terrell
Central Florida
 
J

Jim Bianchi

Jan 1, 1970
0
While you were siting on you fat pot smoking ass trolling to get other
people to create energy for you I bought 3 bicycles at Wal-Mart, hired a
bunch of Mexicans with back packs and scooped your franchise.

Yeah, but are the bezels water-proof? :)
 
M

me

Jan 1, 1970
0
Instead of a counterweight, just use two buckets. Fill the top bucket,
release the brake, and the bucket descends, raising the other bucket.
Set the brake, empty the lower bucket while filling the upper bucket,
and so on.

But that depends on the characteristics of the road - is it straight?
Line-of-sight? Can you claim a lane for your cablecars?

Yes, there is more left out of this problem than left in.
It is also possible (especially on a vertical drop system) to
put several "buckets" on a rotating system and continually
fill and empty them as the "go by". Basically a solid mass
version of a "water wheel".
 
R

Rich Grise

Jan 1, 1970
0
Well, at least till all the butter flys off.

I'd pay $100.00 to see somebody tape a piece of buttered toast to the
back of a cat. ;-)

I'd have no problem covering the #100 - it'd win $10,000 on "America's
Stupidest Videos". ;-)

Cheers!
Rich
 
R

Rich Grise

Jan 1, 1970
0
Yes, there is more left out of this problem than left in.
It is also possible (especially on a vertical drop system) to
put several "buckets" on a rotating system and continually
fill and empty them as the "go by". Basically a solid mass
version of a "water wheel".

Well, the OP did say a paved road uphill to the material, but didn't
say what material, how heavy a bushel is, is the road switchbacks, etc.,
etc., etc....

Thanks,
Rich
 
D

default

Jan 1, 1970
0
I'd pay $100.00 to see somebody tape a piece of buttered toast to the
back of a cat. ;-)

I'd have no problem covering the #100 - it'd win $10,000 on "America's
Stupidest Videos". ;-)

Cheers!
Rich

You'd lose, on both counts. I'd anaesthetize the cat.
 
F

Frank Adam

Jan 1, 1970
0
What happens if you put butter on the top side of the cat?
My Shepheard will pick it up and carry it up and down the mountain.
Ok, you will have to install a new cat after each trip.. but that's
probably good to keep the work safety authorities happy.
 
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