Outdoor CCTV problem

[JakeD]

I'm installing a wireless CCTV system to protect my house. The problem I'm
experiencing is that movement-activation works fine in daylight, but at
night, when the cameras are operating under their 30 LEDs, I get constant
false movement-signals. Can anyone explain why I get the false signals
during nighttime IR operation but not during the day?

What is the remedy? Add standalone IR lamps to increase the IR, perhaps? Or
do I ned a much more sophisticated DVR, that can distinguish between raal
movement and false signals?

Thanks...

JakeD

 

[G. Morgan]

Can anyone explain why I get the false signals
during nighttime IR operation but not during the day?

Cheap equipment, or not enough light. Take your pick, both are probably
correct.

What equipment are you working with?

 

[JakeD]

Cheap equipment, or not enough light. Take your pick, both are probably
correct.

What equipment are you working with?

Yes, the gear was relatively cheap: On the other hand, it is up-to-date
technology, so perhaps it's not all bad. It's a 4-channel DVR/receiver that
records to an SD card, and the 12v cameras have 30 LED's. All made in China
(I think) and purchased on eBay. I actually ended up with two very similar
DVR/receivers, which could be helpful, because using one alone, I have
awful trouble picking up four cameras. There is a lot of interference and
usually one out of the 4 cameras isn't picked up. Perhaps I should try
wiring the cameras to a DVR (luckily the cameras have wire outputs) -
because this wireless setup seems very problematic indeed.

JakeD

 

[JakeD]

Cheap equipment, or not enough light. Take your pick, both are probably
correct.

What equipment are you working with?

I have these two bits of kit, and yes, they were relatively cheap:

http://tinyurl.com/4yv5ws2
and
http://tinyurl.com/3tdqwu2

I'd probably get better results with a wired sytem would I? I suspect a lot
of my problems are to do with wireless reception.

Each of teh receiver/DVR;s has trouble dealing with 4 cameras, despite
claiming to be 4-channel systems. They can deal with three much better, but
they have trouble picking up all 4 cameras - even during daylight.

JakeD

 

[G. Morgan]

I have these two bits of kit, and yes, they were relatively cheap:

http://tinyurl.com/4yv5ws2
and
http://tinyurl.com/3tdqwu2

I'd probably get better results with a wired sytem would I? I suspect a lot
of my problems are to do with wireless reception.

Each of teh receiver/DVR;s has trouble dealing with 4 cameras, despite
claiming to be 4-channel systems. They can deal with three much better, but
they have trouble picking up all 4 cameras - even during daylight.

dude, you're going to have to start over if you want a working system.
If I had a nickel for every time I've heard of people getting burned;
I'd have a dollar or two.

Transmission Type ISM 2400 - 2483 MHz.

That is 802.11g -- 802.11n is 10x faster.

You're better off with hardwiring using CAT5 and install IP cams or
video baluns for analog cams.

Min Illumination O Lux.
Unacceptable

IR Nightvision Range 7 Metres.

Always take what they say the range is, then divide by 3. They lie!

 

[JakeD]

dude, you're going to have to start over if you want a working system.
If I had a nickel for every time I've heard of people getting burned;
I'd have a dollar or two.


That is 802.11g -- 802.11n is 10x faster.

You're better off with hardwiring using CAT5 and install IP cams or
video baluns for analog cams.

Thanks.. I thought about using IP cams, and storing the footage on a web
server somewhere, but then I realised how easy it was for someone to cut
the phone line from the property. I'm not in an area where wireless
internet is very reliable, so I decided to aim for a wireless system so I
could store the video locally, off premises, where the DVR couldn't be
located by following the wires. Little did I realise how problematic this
wireless system would be.

Unacceptable

I assumed that 0 Lux meant no light - which sounded good to me!

Always take what they say the range is, then divide by 3. They lie!

The 7 mtrs is quite truthful, in this case although, at 7 mtrs, things get
a bit less well-lit by the IR, and might not trigger movement activation..

Jake

 

[JakeD]

Please excuse me but ..... unfortunately, you're coming here with a
pair of sissors and you want to know if we can tell you how you can
use them to cut your lawn. Best advice I can give you is to do some
thorough research and then go out and buy a lawn mower. Or ..... pay
someone to provide you with the appropriate tool to do the job. As I'm
sure you know, professionals get paid to do what they do because they'
have the experience, done the homework and the trial and error. You
just didn't dig deep enough to find out what you didn't know about
CCTV. Sorry!

OK - thank you for the input. Agreed, I didn't research *all* of the specs
you mentioned, in detail, but I was in a hurry to get something rigged up
quickly, with no time to do lenthy research. I'm also on a budget, so I
couldn't buy on the "you get what you pay for" premise. It's possible that
I will end up buying an entirely different setup, but for now, I'll have a
go at optimising what I've got - for example by following your suggestions.
The daytime performance is OK (or will be, if I can get all 4 cameras to
register correctly by the receiver). I'm mainly puzzled as to why nighttime
wireless performance is so terrible. Perhaps if I instal extra IR lights it
would improve things...

Jake

 

[Robosama]

and basically IR sucks.

Cheap equipment, or not enough light. Take your pick, both are probably
correct.

What equipment are you working with?

 

[G. Morgan]

Thanks.. I thought about using IP cams, and storing the footage on a web
server somewhere, but then I realised how easy it was for someone to cut
the phone line from the property.

With proper positioning, the motion will detect them by the Telco demark
and a good DVR will upload the footage (FTP) right away. You can also
take measures to 'harden' the demark, or ask the Telco to move it to
your MDF closet inside.

I'm not in an area where wireless
internet is very reliable, so I decided to aim for a wireless system so I
could store the video locally, off premises, where the DVR couldn't be
located by following the wires. Little did I realise how problematic this
wireless system would be.

Both these online vendors have quality parts:
http://www.supercircuits.com/
http://www.123securityproducts.com/

If you want, grab a satellite image of the place and take a screen-shot.
I can help you place them.

Highlight the areas that you are talking about (use Paint, or whatever)
and post the image on a picture host (tinypic). a picture is worth a
1000 words (maybe more).

PS: Block out any identifiable information on the image since its a
school.
--

"I don't like to discriminate against terrorists based on nationality.
If you declare war on the United States and you want to kill us,
We're going to kill you first, period."

October 19, 2011 - Ali Soufan (Colbert Report)

 

[G. Morgan]

Always here, no network, no iPhone, did I mention no network?

Get one, that's one of the best features of the system.

Your idea of simply alarm dedicated monitor is what I used to do, back
when the cameras were vidicons. How much is a starlight camera? no
LEDs

I had my hands on a $60k camera/housing not too long ago. All stainless
steel and explosion proof, heavy mo-fo.

See the links I left a minute ago in this thread. If you want to learn a
lot more about CCTV the forum: www.cctvforum.com has loads of archives
with 'gems' and open forums to ask questions.


--

"I don't like to discriminate against terrorists based on nationality.
If you declare war on the United States and you want to kill us,
We're going to kill you first, period."

October 19, 2011 - Ali Soufan (Colbert Report)

 

[G. Morgan]

hard to believe that while watchiing a Perry Mason episode, the
character was heard to say, "...and he took that $6,000 to build a
beach house in Malibu..." have times changed, or what?

Before my time, that's for sure.

get a network? uh, this house is wired for CAT5 is that the type of
network? what electronic box to plug in, or are these all 'plug n
play'?

What I mean is the network functionality is one of the neatest features.
You just plug it into an empty port on your router. People love being
able to pull up their cams from work, home (for a commercial job),
vacation, whatever.. A web browser is all you need, no iDevices
necessary.

--

"I don't like to discriminate against terrorists based on nationality.
If you declare war on the United States and you want to kill us,
We're going to kill you first, period."

October 19, 2011 - Ali Soufan (Colbert Report)

 

[G. Morgan]

I think the base line for a GREAT system is to sit down and figure out
the level of false alarms I can stand, and if I could accept a single
missed positive Exactly, what type of alarm indicator do I want?
Bell, lights, silent alert with quiet recording?

make a list of needs: is detection enough, or do I want to view what
caused the detected intrusion? yes
1. go stand and look, pretend you're a camera, what are you trying to
see? when - dark, light, into sun? Use digital camera to get a
'flavor' for what a camera sees.
then decide camera, lense, distance, field of view, weather the camera
will be submitted to, lighting
2. what to do with the screen shots
how often 'review' info, amount of storage, type of storage
3. how to view
real time/post production, separate monitors, or insert in TV system,
etc this function appears to be where most of the whiz bang hype
lurks now.

Did I miss anything? Something I should also consider?

do you have a monitored alarm system? If so, you can send pictures to
the monitoring center and they will react based on what set it off.
--

"I don't like to discriminate against terrorists based on nationality.
If you declare war on the United States and you want to kill us,
We're going to kill you first, period."

October 19, 2011 - Ali Soufan (Colbert Report)

 

[G. Morgan]

Get all
equipment with all the bells and whistles even if you don't use half
of them ...... because you just can't predict what you're going to run
into and if you don't have the built in features to handle it, .....
as an expert, that's not something I can afford.

That includes small issues like cable selection. I've been using Cat5e
exclusively for cams now. Video baluns are reliable and inexpensive now.
Not only do you get the benefit of upgrading to all IP cams in the
future easily; plus it's cheaper than Siamese cable & BNC fittings. AND
its easier to run since the cable is smaller, conventional security
installation tools/drill bits make quick work of fetching & runnning the
cables.



--

"I don't like to discriminate against terrorists based on nationality.
If you declare war on the United States and you want to kill us,
We're going to kill you first, period."

October 19, 2011 - Ali Soufan (Colbert Report)