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Problem with a Sony Multiscan E500

S

Starflex

Jan 1, 1970
0
Hi to everybody!
I have a problem with this monitor:the "black" doesn't appear black..but
only "light black"..almost green...
Searching in the service manual, have found that there is a rail, +80v CC
(without particular signal wave), that in my monitor is "only" 78,6v CC.
In the service manual there isn' t wrote the tollerance for this (ex, +-
0,2v).. but this line @ 80V gave the power to the RGB AMP board.
I had seen the power supply board and the line @ +80V appears ok.
So I want to test if the problem is the lower voltage: can I put a 1,5 volts
cell in series to the + 80v circuit?

Of course only for a momentt, just the time to see if the problem is solved
or not.

What do you think about this ideas? I'm an idiot to think this? :)
 
K

Ken

Jan 1, 1970
0
Starflex said:
Hi to everybody!
I have a problem with this monitor:the "black" doesn't appear black..but
only "light black"..almost green...
Searching in the service manual, have found that there is a rail, +80v CC
(without particular signal wave), that in my monitor is "only" 78,6v CC.
In the service manual there isn' t wrote the tollerance for this (ex, +-
0,2v).. but this line @ 80V gave the power to the RGB AMP board.
I had seen the power supply board and the line @ +80V appears ok.
So I want to test if the problem is the lower voltage: can I put a 1,5 volts
cell in series to the + 80v circuit?

Of course only for a momentt, just the time to see if the problem is solved
or not.

What do you think about this ideas? I'm an idiot to think this? :)

Is this one of the monitors where you cannot darken the picture enough?
If so, you might have the infamous Sony G2 problem that requires a
modification so that it is reduced. You do not want to mess with the
"Rail" that you describe. Write back with the answer to if you can
reduce the contrast and brightness to a dark level, and I might be able
to help you.
 
S

Starflex

Jan 1, 1970
0
Ken said:
Is this one of the monitors where you cannot darken the picture
enough? If so, you might have the infamous Sony G2 problem that
requires a modification so that it is reduced. You do not want to
mess with the "Rail" that you describe. Write back with the answer
to if you can reduce the contrast and brightness to a dark level, and
I might be able to help you.

Hi Ken,

Sorry, I'm italian and I have some difficulties to explain correctly the
problem (..of course, not because "I'm Italian"...but because I don't speak
english very well..! :) )
First of all, if you want, you can download the service manual (PDF) from
this site:

www.scooterclub-nolimits.it/E500.pdf

Now I try to describe the problem.
I gave this monitor for free, from a friend, that don' t use it because it
had some problems.
The monitor was very "out of convergence", and I solved the problem only
moving the fold poles on the tube, and finally using the regulation of the
OSD.
But the principal problem, now, is another: the monitor appear too bright.
If I put the brightness at the lower valour, and the contrast at the higher
one, the monitor is too bright.
The red appear nearly orange, the black appear too bright...like a black
t-shirt that you have washed many and many times (sorry for the stupid
example).
This is the problem.
Moreover, at this time, I don't have an oscilloscope (sigh!) to check signal
form...
 
S

Starflex

Jan 1, 1970
0
Ken said:
If so, you might have the infamous Sony G2 problem that
requires a modification so that it is reduced.

...uhm...I think that you are speaking about this:

http://www.geocities.com/gregua/windas/

Probably this is the problem...you gave me a good way to search in Google,
speaking me about "Sony G2 problem"!
 
K

Ken

Jan 1, 1970
0
Starflex said:
Hi Ken,

Sorry, I'm italian and I have some difficulties to explain correctly the
problem (..of course, not because "I'm Italian"...but because I don't speak
english very well..! :) )
First of all, if you want, you can download the service manual (PDF) from
this site:

www.scooterclub-nolimits.it/E500.pdf

Now I try to describe the problem.
I gave this monitor for free, from a friend, that don' t use it because it
had some problems.
The monitor was very "out of convergence", and I solved the problem only
moving the fold poles on the tube, and finally using the regulation of the
OSD.
But the principal problem, now, is another: the monitor appear too bright.
If I put the brightness at the lower valour, and the contrast at the higher
one, the monitor is too bright.
The red appear nearly orange, the black appear too bright...like a black
t-shirt that you have washed many and many times (sorry for the stupid
example).
This is the problem.
Moreover, at this time, I don't have an oscilloscope (sigh!) to check signal
form...

First off your English is fine. You might use different descriptive
words than I would use, but I think I understand what your problem is.
The monitor you have is NOT the same one I have. Mine is a 19" Dell
Trinitron made by Sony and the problem sure sounds the same. Below are
a few links that might not be exactly about your monitor, but you should
get the idea of what the problem is if your monitor is of the same type.

The monitor has a port that can be used to adjust the G2 voltage, but
it requires software and an adapter be made. The details on how to do
this are probably mentioned in the links below. The only problem is it
is a lot of work for only one monitor. If you had many, it might be the
way to go.

There is however a modification that can be made to bring the monitor
into a usable setting. On my 19" monitor my notes say to replace R459
(10Meg) with a 4.6-6.8Meg one. (If the present value of that resistor
is not accurate, disregard the value and resistor number I suggested.)
There then is another (different) resistor that you must modify rather
than the one I suggested. The links I suggested might give you the
correct one? The resistor is of course in the rear of the monitor on a
vertical mounted PWB above the flyback area. It is not on the main
horizontal PWB that the flyback transformer is mounted.

The key is you are modifying the bias for the transistor controlling
the G2 voltage to the CRT. Once you find the current resistor, jumper
in some different values until you get the correct brightness. Do this
check with your brightness and contrast at the midrange setting.

http://www.short-media.com/forum/showthread.php?t=19549&page=14
http://www.geocities.com/gregua/windas/
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=Sony+G500&btnG=Google+Search

If you write back I will try to answer any questions you might have or
suggest where you might find more answers. A search on Google for "G2
too high, Sony, Dell, Trinitron, etc." might also be productive.
 
E

Eeyore

Jan 1, 1970
0
Starflex said:
Hi to everybody!
I have a problem with this monitor:the "black" doesn't appear black..but
only "light black"..almost green...

I have an E530.

Do you have the on screen menu ? Go to the COLOR menu - below the color
temperature setting select *IMAGE RESTORATION* and select it !

It worked for me. Better now than it was when delivered in fact.


Graham
 
S

Starflex

Jan 1, 1970
0
Ken said:
First off your English is fine. You might use different descriptive
words than I would use, but I think I understand what your problem is.
The monitor you have is NOT the same one I have. Mine is a 19" Dell
Trinitron made by Sony and the problem sure sounds the same. Below
are a few links that might not be exactly about your monitor, but you
should get the idea of what the problem is if your monitor is of the
same type.

Thank you Ken!
Moreover...your monitor (Sony/Dell 19") is the SAME monitor (I think..mine
is Sony multiscan E400) that i'm using now.
And I have also a question for this screen: i had some problem with the
convergence...
Also in your monitor is "quite impossible" to obtain a correct convergence
in all parts of the screen?
Using, of course, all the "fold poles" on the tube and the regluations on
the "Menu' "..
I don' t obtain a perfect convergence...
The monitor has a port that can be used to adjust the G2 voltage, but
it requires software and an adapter be made. The details on how to do
this are probably mentioned in the links below. The only problem is
it is a lot of work for only one monitor. If you had many, it might
be the way to go.

uhmm.. I think that I try this way, if I found the cable, or if I can make
it with a few money.
There is however a modification that can be made to bring the monitor
into a usable setting. On my 19" monitor my notes say to replace R459
(10Meg) with a 4.6-6.8Meg one. (If the present value of that resistor
is not accurate, disregard the value and resistor number I suggested.)
There then is another (different) resistor that you must modify rather
than the one I suggested. The links I suggested might give you the
correct one? The resistor is of course in the rear of the monitor on
a vertical mounted PWB above the flyback area. It is not on the main
horizontal PWB that the flyback transformer is mounted.

The key is you are modifying the bias for the transistor controlling
the G2 voltage to the CRT. Once you find the current resistor, jumper
in some different values until you get the correct brightness. Do
this check with your brightness and contrast at the midrange setting.
http://www.short-media.com/forum/showthread.php?t=19549&page=14
http://www.geocities.com/gregua/windas/
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=Sony+G500&btnG=Google+Search

Perfect, I think that you gave me the solution.
First of all, I search a way to made the cable and use the software to
correct the problem.
But, if I find it too expensive, or too long (I think, too long!), I try the
solutions of the resistors, buying some resistors and finding the correct
value for the better image.
If you write back I will try to answer any questions you might have or
suggest where you might find more answers. A search on Google for "G2
too high, Sony, Dell, Trinitron, etc." might also be productive.

Thank you a lot, Ken, you are very kind.
Now I search, with the help of "Saint Google", all the info for using the
digital alignment software (moreover, in ofe of the link, there is a great
guide).
Thank you, thank you, thank you! :)
 
E

Eeyore

Jan 1, 1970
0
Starflex said:
Thank you Ken!
Moreover...your monitor (Sony/Dell 19") is the SAME monitor (I think..mine
is Sony multiscan E400) that i'm using now.

Yes, Dell used a Sony chassis AIUI.

I found myself in the same position as you about a year ago and actually bought
another (second-hand) 21" Sony as a possible replacement on ebay. I was talking
to the seller about picking it up and he gave me the tip about color
restoration. It works a treat ! As a result I still haven't yet used that
monitor but I just got a PCI video card for a second display and soon I'll have
2 21" Sonys in front of me.

Graham
 
S

Starflex

Jan 1, 1970
0
Eeyore said:
Do you have the on screen menu ? Go to the COLOR menu - below the
color temperature setting select *IMAGE RESTORATION* and select it !

It worked for me. Better now than it was when delivered in fact.

Uhmm...in My E500 there isn't the "IMAGE RESTORATION" selection, under the
menu..
I had seen ALL the sub-menu....
 
K

Ken

Jan 1, 1970
0
Starflex said:
Thank you Ken!
Moreover...your monitor (Sony/Dell 19") is the SAME monitor (I think..mine
is Sony multiscan E400) that i'm using now.
And I have also a question for this screen: i had some problem with the
convergence...
Also in your monitor is "quite impossible" to obtain a correct convergence
in all parts of the screen?
Using, of course, all the "fold poles" on the tube and the regluations on
the "Menu' "..
I don' t obtain a perfect convergence...

I am not sure exactly where you are at with your problem right now, as
there have been additional posts regarding it. But I would like to
suggest you clear up the G2 problem before you adjust other items like
convergence. At least that is what I would do before attempting them.
If you mess with convergence and it is not needed, you could make a
bigger headache for yourself. Just my two cents.
 
S

Starflex

Jan 1, 1970
0
Ken said:
I am not sure exactly where you are at with your problem right now, as
there have been additional posts regarding it. But I would like to
suggest you clear up the G2 problem before you adjust other items like
convergence. At least that is what I would do before attempting them.
If you mess with convergence and it is not needed, you could make a
bigger headache for yourself. Just my two cents.

Just a moment: i have TWO monitors.
The 21" one, that is "overbright", and the 19" that is out of convergence.
The E50, 21", now is open and I'm not using it (I have orded the cable to
use WINDAS Sony recalibration software), instead I'm using the 19" (that had
perfet colours and correct G2 value, and is only is out of convergence).
In this last one, 19", probably I can solve the problem with the same
program. I had read that there is also a sub menu that can correct defect of
gometry,etc...
 
K

Ken

Jan 1, 1970
0
Starflex said:
Just a moment: i have TWO monitors.
The 21" one, that is "overbright", and the 19" that is out of convergence.
The E50, 21", now is open and I'm not using it (I have orded the cable to
use WINDAS Sony recalibration software), instead I'm using the 19" (that had
perfet colours and correct G2 value, and is only is out of convergence).
In this last one, 19", probably I can solve the problem with the same
program. I had read that there is also a sub menu that can correct defect of
gometry,etc...

OK, I misunderstood. I thought you had a monitor that exhibited both
problems. From what I read you can perform just about everything with
the software and cable, so you are probably correct in expecting the
convergence problem to be corrected as well. Should you get a cable and
try the software, post a new message in the news group telling us how it
worked. I would be interested in your results. Good luck.
 
S

Starflex

Jan 1, 1970
0
Ken said:
OK, I misunderstood. I thought you had a monitor that exhibited both
problems. From what I read you can perform just about everything with
the software and cable, so you are probably correct in expecting the
convergence problem to be corrected as well. Should you get a cable
and try the software, post a new message in the news group telling us
how it worked. I would be interested in your results. Good luck.

Perfect, Ken.
I have buyed the cable/adaptator and d/loaded the program.
I think that the cable need about 10 days to arrive ( sigh..), but BE SURE
that I post a new message with the results, in the 21" and also in the 19"
one.
You have traced me the correct way to find the problem: thank you a lot!
 
E

Eeyore

Jan 1, 1970
0
Starflex said:
Uhmm...in My E500 there isn't the "IMAGE RESTORATION" selection, under the
menu..
I had seen ALL the sub-menu....

It has an icon that's totally meaningless. Do look again. It's under the COLOR
menu. There are only 2 options - set color temperature and color restoration on
my E530. It works a treat too.

Graham
 
S

Starflex

Jan 1, 1970
0
Eeyore said:
It has an icon that's totally meaningless. Do look again. It's under
the COLOR menu. There are only 2 options - set color temperature and
color restoration on my E530. It works a treat too.

Wait.
I push the button. I go to the right and I enter into the "color " menu.
Now I have three possiblitites: "Easy", "Expert" and "SRGB".
In none of these there is a icon or a "color restoration" possibilities...
 
E

Eeyore

Jan 1, 1970
0
Starflex said:
Wait.
I push the button. I go to the right and I enter into the "color " menu.
Now I have three possiblitites: "Easy", "Expert" and "SRGB".
In none of these there is a icon or a "color restoration" possibilities...

Maybe it's not on that model then.

Have you got a service manual btw ? I found one here...
http://www.eserviceinfo.com/download.php?fileid=18433

I don't know how you link and open tar files though.

Graham
 
A

Andy Cuffe

Jan 1, 1970
0
..uhm...I think that you are speaking about this:

http://www.geocities.com/gregua/windas/

Probably this is the problem...you gave me a good way to search in Google,
speaking me about "Sony G2 problem"!

Thanks for posting that. It will be very useful. I built a cable
several years ago for the DOS version, but it was almost impossible to
use without the special test generators and color meter.

Is there a way to add older models to the database? It's the older
ones like the GDM-W900 and even GDM-20SE1 that could use the most
adjustment these days. Most are so far off that I don't even bother
with them any more.
Andy Cuffe

[email protected]
 
A

Andy Cuffe

Jan 1, 1970
0
Wait.
I push the button. I go to the right and I enter into the "color " menu.
Now I have three possiblitites: "Easy", "Expert" and "SRGB".
In none of these there is a icon or a "color restoration" possibilities...

I think it's in the option menu on some monitors. If it's too old it
won't have it though. They added this feature around 2001, but it
doesn't work on the 21" monitors from that year. They go through the
motions, but I've never seen a 21" from 2001 where it made much
difference to the picture. It works like magic on the 19" from 2001
and the later 21" ones.
Andy Cuffe

[email protected]
 
S

Starflex

Jan 1, 1970
0
Andy said:
I think it's in the option menu on some monitors. If it's too old it
won't have it though. They added this feature around 2001, but it
doesn't work on the 21" monitors from that year. They go through the
motions, but I've never seen a 21" from 2001 where it made much
difference to the picture. It works like magic on the 19" from 2001
and the later 21" ones.

My E500 was manufactured on December 2000.It was dismissed about in 2004 for
this problem (overbright) , and the old owner gave me it.
So I have picked up it about two months ago.
In the menu there isn' t this option, I'm sure.
Probably, Sony introduced this feature for further model to solve this
problem...that is very common, I see...
 
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