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software to hardware - help

N

Neo

Jan 1, 1970
0
Folks, How difficult it is for a software guy to learn working with
hardware. I've been working on embedded systems for about 4 years. Worked on
various platforms like TI DSP, Morotola, Intel x86 etc. Having sound
knowledge of C, Assembly, DD, RTOS and other system level stuff. I want to
learn some basic skill on hardware side (like soldering etc.) to prototype
some very simple circuits. My main focus is on Firmware designing and RTOS.
Do I need to take up some course in basic electronics?

What are the essential tools that I need to buy in order to get started
playing with hardware?

Books for a beginner like me (who dont have any background in electronics)?

Some of you guy might have faced the same thing. It would be really helpful
for me to get advice and tips, and quickly get started.

Thanks and Regards,
-Neo
 
Subscribe to Nuts&Volts and CircuitCellar magazine and walk through
some of their tutorial projects and visits sites like:
http://www.kitsrus.com
for inexpensive kits to play with

Personally I wouldn't bother with taking a class. Your time is better
forcused when you guide the subject matter yourself, (except for the
rare case with exceptional instructors).
 
N

Noway2

Jan 1, 1970
0
The answer depends on wether you take the blue pill or the red pill.
Sorry, but I couldn't resist with you using the name Neo.
From you message, it sounds like you are interested in technician style
work, as you mention soldering and basic prototying. You may be able
to find some classes at a community or technical college that would
help you gain some hands on experience with the correct methods to use.
Also look for certification trainging that may be offered in your
area. Personally, I took a class in SMT rework and have been very
comfortable with soldering and desoldering ever since. While I am
certain that some may disagree with my suggestion I find that there
really is no substitute for learning from someone who knows how to
teach a subject properly.

If you are interested in learning electronics theory, which will go a
long ways towards your goal, I would recommend the book, The Art of
Electronics and the corresponding lab work book by Horowitz and Hill.
The book covers many of the fundemental aspects of analog and digital
electronics from a "this is how you use and apply it" perspective. The
book covers how to analyze circuits and components from a practical -
real work perspective. Armed with this book, I would suggest getting
some basic equipment, such as a bread board, digital multi meter and
power supply. You may wish to purchase some basic parts to perform the
experiements in the book, but these should be available from any online
electronics supplier, such as Digikey.

Good Luck and enjoy your trip down the rabbit hole!
 
M

Mel Wilson

Jan 1, 1970
0
[ ... ] I want to
learn some basic skill on hardware side (like soldering etc.) to prototype
some very simple circuits. My main focus is on Firmware designing and RTOS.
Do I need to take up some course in basic electronics?

What are the essential tools that I need to buy in order to get started
playing with hardware?

- a multimeter
- a logic probe
- as big a Wish Board (or equivalent brand) as you can stand
getting. This is one of those large socket/terminal
blocks that can accept DIP chips and component leads and
so on, for prototyping circuits.
- fine solid wire left by phone installers

A good, cheap electronic parts store in the neighbourhood
is an immense help.
Books for a beginner like me (who dont have any background in electronics)?

Yes, mandatory. Other people than I will know what's
current. I used _Electronic Design with Off-the-shelf
Integrated Circuits_, but I got it remaindered. I bet it's
unfindable now. Obsolete, too.

Manufacturers sites on the world-wide web have the data
sheets you need, and there are lots of sample applications
in these.

I subscribed to Elektor and Electronic Musician for a few
years. I don't know if Electronic Musician pushes
do-it-yourself as much as they used to.
Some of you guy might have faced the same thing. It would be really helpful
for me to get advice and tips, and quickly get started.

I moved from big-iron software support to embedded
programming. The biggest change is that I can now afford to
own the computers I work on. Everything else is about the
same. An engineer who'd worked for Marconi was talking
lately about an early monster with about 128 words of data
memory. It sounded pretty much like an ATtiny28.

Mel.
 
R

Richard Owlett

Jan 1, 1970
0
Neo said:
Folks, How difficult it is for a software guy to learn working with
hardware. I've been working on embedded systems for about 4 years. Worked on
various platforms like TI DSP, Morotola, Intel x86 etc. Having sound
knowledge of C, Assembly, DD, RTOS and other system level stuff. I want to
learn some basic skill on hardware side (like soldering etc.) to prototype
some very simple circuits. My main focus is on Firmware designing and RTOS.
Do I need to take up some course in basic electronics?

What are the essential tools that I need to buy in order to get started
playing with hardware?

Books for a beginner like me (who dont have any background in electronics)?

Some of you guy might have faced the same thing. It would be really helpful
for me to get advice and tips, and quickly get started.

Thanks and Regards,
-Neo

I think you should think in terms of "component level
hardware/electronics". Please note I intentionally made no mention of
software ;}

My gut reaction would be "look for local Amateur Radio club". AKA
"hams". These days they cover a broad range of interests.

I may be out of date.
I remember type 80's, 6J6's, and CK722's.
I've seen a *LEGAL* spark gap transmitter operate ;}

Am I dated?
 
T

Tauno Voipio

Jan 1, 1970
0
Richard said:
I think you should think in terms of "component level
hardware/electronics". Please note I intentionally made no mention of
software ;}

My gut reaction would be "look for local Amateur Radio club". AKA
"hams". These days they cover a broad range of interests.

In the same line of thought, the ARRL Handbook may be
I may be out of date.
I remember type 80's, 6J6's, and CK722's.
I've seen a *LEGAL* spark gap transmitter operate ;}

Am I dated?

It depends on yourself - if you've running with the development,
no problem.

I've also used 807's, 813's and 866A's.
 
J

John Fields

Jan 1, 1970
0
I think you should think in terms of "component level
hardware/electronics". Please note I intentionally made no mention of
software ;}

My gut reaction would be "look for local Amateur Radio club". AKA
"hams". These days they cover a broad range of interests.

I may be out of date.
I remember type 80's, 6J6's, and CK722's.
I've seen a *LEGAL* spark gap transmitter operate ;}

Am I dated?

---
Dunno...

If you've got a good line, maybe...

Otherwise, the young studs will be attracting the uncommitted pussy.
 
I

Ian Bell

Jan 1, 1970
0
Neo said:
Folks, How difficult it is for a software guy to learn working with
hardware. I've been working on embedded systems for about 4 years. Worked
on various platforms like TI DSP, Morotola, Intel x86 etc. Having sound
knowledge of C, Assembly, DD, RTOS and other system level stuff. I want to
learn some basic skill on hardware side (like soldering etc.) to prototype
some very simple circuits. My main focus is on Firmware designing and
RTOS. Do I need to take up some course in basic electronics?

I would say it is incredibly hard to make the transition in this direction.
Software is at least an order of magnitude less complex than hardware so it
is difficult to become a good hardware engineer. Many people make the
transition in the other direction from mechanical engineering and
mathematics to software.

Ian

Ian
 
J

Jasen Betts

Jan 1, 1970
0
["Followup-To:" header set to sci.electronics.basics.]
Folks, How difficult it is for a software guy to learn working with
hardware. I've been working on embedded systems for about 4 years. Worked on
various platforms like TI DSP, Morotola, Intel x86 etc. Having sound
knowledge of C, Assembly, DD, RTOS and other system level stuff. I want to
learn some basic skill on hardware side (like soldering etc.) to prototype
some very simple circuits. My main focus is on Firmware designing and RTOS.
Do I need to take up some course in basic electronics?

What are the essential tools that I need to buy in order to get started
playing with hardware?

essestial:

some good solder.

That's it.... you can play with electronics using a wire from a coat-hanger
heated on the kitchen hotplate as a soldering iron, and a simple continuity
teester made with a few AA cells and a salvaged LED....

in the almost essential list:

a soldering iron.

a heat-resistant, (or scrificial) work surface

a bench vice or other extra hand...

small pliers both long nose, and angle cutters.

a multimmeter, I'd go with an analogue model first, they're easier to read.

if you're into playing with digital stuff something to power them
apropriately even if it's just a 9VDC plugpack and a 7805 regulator.

anti-static devices equipment if you're wanting to play with CMOS.

otherwise a 20 pack of cheap AA dry cells can handle most tasks....

the nice to have list:

a second multimeter - go with a digital one for precision readings, and you
can also use both together to mesure th status in two
parts of the circuit at the same time...

a propane blow torch - great for salvaging components from obsolete equipment.

a wire stripper - sure you can strip wires using two pairs of pliers but it;s
a whole lot easier with one of these...

a selection of parts, nuts and bolts and other random hardware

solderless breadboard

some prototyping board (either stripboard, unconnected perf, or some other
connection scheme.


As for what to study, you probably are already familiar with digital logic,
so got the other way, refresh your knowledge of
Ohms's law and kirchoff's current laws. get some practice reaading the
resistor colour code.

passive RC filter networks.

build yourself a LED flasher.

Bye.
Jasen
 
A

Andy Baxter

Jan 1, 1970
0
Neo said:
Folks, How difficult it is for a software guy to learn working with
hardware. I've been working on embedded systems for about 4 years. Worked on
various platforms like TI DSP, Morotola, Intel x86 etc. Having sound
knowledge of C, Assembly, DD, RTOS and other system level stuff. I want to
learn some basic skill on hardware side (like soldering etc.) to prototype
some very simple circuits. My main focus is on Firmware designing and RTOS.
Do I need to take up some course in basic electronics?

What are the essential tools that I need to buy in order to get started
playing with hardware?

Books for a beginner like me (who dont have any background in electronics)?

Horowitz and Hill - 'The Art of Electronics' is a good, well written,
introduction to electronics.
 
C

Charles Schuler

Jan 1, 1970
0
You have received some good advice here. I'll add that picaxe chips are a
lot of fun and there is wide range of internet sources for software,
schematics and so on.
 
N

nobody

Jan 1, 1970
0
Neo said:
Folks, How difficult it is for a software guy to learn working with
hardware. I've been working on embedded systems for about 4 years. Worked on
various platforms like TI DSP, Morotola, Intel x86 etc. Having sound
knowledge of C, Assembly, DD, RTOS and other system level stuff. I want to
learn some basic skill on hardware side (like soldering etc.) to prototype
some very simple circuits. My main focus is on Firmware designing and RTOS.
Do I need to take up some course in basic electronics?

What are the essential tools that I need to buy in order to get started
playing with hardware?

Books for a beginner like me (who dont have any background in electronics)?

Some of you guy might have faced the same thing. It would be really helpful
for me to get advice and tips, and quickly get started.

Thanks and Regards,
-Neo


Its really not as difficult as some would make out ... tho i suppose it's
depends on your aptitude, perhaps just as important your 'determination' ...
and also the level of complexity you wish to move it. Much like yourself,
was a programmer, wishing to take up electronics as a hobby. Digital
electronics is actually fairly easy ... it's such connecting a bunch of
black-box chips together - I'd grab a quick an easy guide to analog
electronics ... to lend the fundamentals .. and a digital electronics book
.... then start playing about with a few kits - its the best way to learn ..

As for how i got on ...5 years on ... well ... my last little project was a
dual wireless phone + base station ... connects to the PC and phone line ...
allows me to switch from voip, skype, landline and send sms's by gsm card
:) ...
 
N

Neo

Jan 1, 1970
0
Noway2 said:
The answer depends on wether you take the blue pill or the red pill.
Sorry, but I couldn't resist with you using the name Neo.

work, as you mention soldering and basic prototying. You may be able
to find some classes at a community or technical college that would
help you gain some hands on experience with the correct methods to use.
Also look for certification trainging that may be offered in your
area. Personally, I took a class in SMT rework and have been very
comfortable with soldering and desoldering ever since. While I am
certain that some may disagree with my suggestion I find that there
really is no substitute for learning from someone who knows how to
teach a subject properly.

If you are interested in learning electronics theory, which will go a
long ways towards your goal, I would recommend the book, The Art of
Electronics and the corresponding lab work book by Horowitz and Hill.
The book covers many of the fundemental aspects of analog and digital
electronics from a "this is how you use and apply it" perspective. The
book covers how to analyze circuits and components from a practical -
real work perspective. Armed with this book, I would suggest getting
some basic equipment, such as a bread board, digital multi meter and
power supply. You may wish to purchase some basic parts to perform the
experiements in the book, but these should be available from any online
electronics supplier, such as Digikey.

Good Luck and enjoy your trip down the rabbit hole!

Thanks a lot.
A grabbed a copy of "The Art of Electronics" and basic tools - Multimeter,
Soldering Iron, cutting pliers, Breadboard, General purpose PCB, a variable
DC output adapter, 25-pin male D connector (for parallel port interfacing),
555 Timer IC, a bunch of LEDs, registors, capcitors and transistors etc.
from the local store. Its really exicting to play with these things. Things
are up and running... :)

But I didn't found the Lab Workbook. Is it necessary to have a copy?

-Neo
 
N

Neo

Jan 1, 1970
0
nobody said:
Its really not as difficult as some would make out ... tho i suppose it's
depends on your aptitude, perhaps just as important your 'determination'
...
and also the level of complexity you wish to move it. Much like yourself,
was a programmer, wishing to take up electronics as a hobby. Digital
electronics is actually fairly easy ... it's such connecting a bunch of
black-box chips together - I'd grab a quick an easy guide to analog
electronics ... to lend the fundamentals .. and a digital electronics book
... then start playing about with a few kits - its the best way to learn
..

As for how i got on ...5 years on ... well ... my last little project was
a
dual wireless phone + base station ... connects to the PC and phone line
...
allows me to switch from voip, skype, landline and send sms's by gsm card
:) ...

That sounds amazing. Digital electronics I know quite a lot. Which
microcontroller/microprocessor will be a good start? PICAXE seems quick and
fast. How about ARM, MIPS etc. though i am not targeting these at this
stage, its for later what I would like to use. For now I want "Play With It
Yourself" on a tight budget and yet the power and flexibility to build real
world gadgets.

Cheers,
-Neo
"Do you Really think, What you think REAL is Really REAL?"
 
N

Noway2

Jan 1, 1970
0
I wouldn't say that it is necesary, however you might find it both
helpfull and enjoyable to have it.

The lab workbook does two things. One it provides a different
perspective on some of the critical concepts that can be somewhat
difficult to understand initially. Second it presents a number of
recommended realtively simple experiments to perform on a bench, which
in my opinion is the real value of the book.
 
N

nobody

Jan 1, 1970
0
Neo said:
That sounds amazing. Digital electronics I know quite a lot. Which
microcontroller/microprocessor will be a good start? PICAXE seems quick and
fast. How about ARM, MIPS etc. though i am not targeting these at this
stage, its for later what I would like to use. For now I want "Play With It
Yourself" on a tight budget and yet the power and flexibility to build real
world gadgets.

Cheers,
-Neo
"Do you Really think, What you think REAL is Really REAL?"

PIXAXE?? ... took a glance at the site and yeah! seem's like a good place to
start ... i started off on the Microchip product line too ... my first
project, the "hello world" equivalent to embedded hobbyists - controlling a
bunch of LED's :) ... which had me excited for all of 10 minutes ... ARM &
MIPS? .. not much experience i'm afraid, never used MIPS. As for ARM - i've
worked on them, but only from a 'software perspective' ... from the sounds
of which, you've more experience than i.

the project? (dual wireless thingies) cheers for the thumbs up :) ...
built it, and worked ... but decided the change the plan! .. no bulk level
purchase's meant scaling up was too damn costly ...
 
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