Treadmill potentiometer/pwm?

[Sirchawlez]

Hey there everybody, I know there are a million different videos and such regarding this topic but I think I may be the one odd ball who managed to collect multiple treadmill motors/boards that are not the normal/typical boards seen in the videos, I say this because I don't see on any of the boards any obvious place to attach a potentiometer, I have purchased multiple pots from 5k-100k and also purchased a pwm controller, I'm happy to use either I'm just attempting to understand where exactly to connect them to be able to control speed on the motors, any help would be greatly appreciated and I am fully aware working with ac can be dangerous and will be using all safety measures to avoid any injury to myself, I'm not a total noob with electronics I just don't want to risk hooking this up incorrectly and burning out a $100+ dollar board in the process, here are a couple pictures of the motors and boards I have collected, you opinions on which motor/board to use for easiest setup/use is also appreciated! I wish I got one of the simple boards that have an obvious 3 connectors for pot placement but these boards apparently don't have that from I could tell. Anyways here they are and thanks in advance for anyone who is willing to take the time to reply, if feeling adventurous feel free to point out the spots for connections on the pictures to simply things even moreso, once I have this setup correctly I plan on making a video for it since I don't see any videos with these boards out there and will happily give credit to whomever helps me in figuring this out! one motor has 2 wires coming from it, the other has 3 red blk and ground, and the third has 4 wires red and blk and two blue.

 

[Minder]

The two blue wires are usually a thermal sensor in the motor.
The MC2100 versions use a PWM 20Hz signal into HD2 socket to emulate the console signal.
There are 555 circuits out there, I also made some up using a 8pin picmicro. with stop start P.B. inputs.
With MC2100 the input is isolated from the mains circuitry.

 

[Sirchawlez]

Yes im familiar with the thermal wires, but unfortunately I don't have a mc2100 board I don't believe, picture are of what I have, I do have one board that is mc5100dts but I don't know where to connect the potentiometer on the board specifically, would it be to one of the multi-pin plugs? There is a 2 pin, 3 pin and a 12 pin and a 5 pin, plus 3 pairs of male hookups an 1 single male, I assume for the male hookups that two would be for motor and 2 would be for power in but unsure on the last pair? They are labeled (a+Lg4, a-Lg5), (ac hot Lg2, ac neut Lg3) (r1 Lg6 r2 Lg7) and last one is just Lg1. If I were to hookup a pot where exactly would I solder it into? Thanks for your reply really appreciate it.

 

[Minder]

Appears you have a version of it, MC5100, looks almost identical to the MC2100's.
It also appears to have the same HD2, 8 pin socket that takes the PWM command signal.
Previously used to interface the console.
The motor and power connections are plainly marked.

 

[Sirchawlez]

Appears you have a version of it, MC5100, looks almost identical to the MC2100's.
It also appears to have the same HD2, 8 pin socket that takes the PWM command signal.
Previously used to interface the console.
The motor and power connections are plainly marked.

Awesome, so I would just wire up the pwm to the 8 pin slot? Could you let me know which pins exactly to connect them to? I assume soldering directly to them would be ok? I don't believe I have a 8 pin connector laying around but I'll look for one first before attempting to solder. Just need to know if the board is facing you which pins do I need to wire to? And lastly should I use a choke like the on I have in picture connected to other board attached to the 5100 one? If so where in the circuit would you recommend me hooking it up to? I thought you would put it connected to the motor wires between the board and the motor? But do I have that incorrect? Or do I need it at all? And the pwm display I show in picture I assume will be adequate for running the motor? Thanks again for taking your time to assist me I really appreciate.

 

[Sirchawlez]

And on the 5100 board there isn't an 8 pin but there is a 12 pin one? Also on the 5100 board there is those spot for 3 pairs of blade connections I know 1 set is for power in and one for motor but what is the other pair used for? And lastly there is a single blade connection Lg1 just below the 12 pin connection when facing you, what would that one be used for or do I not need to worry about it? Sorry. Wish I knew how to read circuit boards more clearly. Correction one last question, the motor that goes with the 5100 board somehow lost one of the motor brushes, I searched online but couldn't find an exact replacement and most of them were like $30-50 usd which seems expensive for a piece of carbon and spring with wire on it do you know of anywhere to buy them for less? Your the man! Thanks again.

 

[Minder]

I don't really have any knowledge of the MC5100 series, but I would surmise that LG1 is a GND connection, try metering it to LV common or the chassis.
As to the 12pin HD2 the PWM normally goes to a small value resistor then to a 4 pin opto, on the MC2100 it is pin 1 (Common) and pin 4, PWM in.
Pin 1 is the bottom pin nearest where LG1 is.
I don't have any idea what LG6 & 7 are?
There is a company (Helwig-Carbon) I have dealt with for brushes, but not sure what they would charge for a couple like that,
Some sort of reverse-engineering of some of the questionable items could probably answer them.
There is the schematic here on the site if you do a search for the MC2100 version, which may help in some of the areas, Most likely it is very similar in many ways.
If you have a motor choke, it is wise to use one if available.

 

[Sirchawlez]

Ok thanks very much for the info I truly appreciate it since I have been stuck for a while now trying to find answers and kept coming up empty due to the boards I have not being the ones commonly shown in tutorials etc. You have been very helpful, I'll try and find out what they are for but the 3 pairs of blade connections, the one is power into board and one is to motor and the last pair could it be possibly to power a fan? Just trying to guess what it could possibly be, or would a fan more likely be powered from one of the pin connection spots? Wish there was a simple guide for rigging this board up, I would make a video for it since there isn't any info on it that I have found online so could be helpful so others but still unsure about so many aspects of the board that any video would be extremely uninformed and basic sounding that it probably wouldn't be much help to anyone. But still if I manage to get it working for my project I might make one anyways with just the simple hookup instructions since I have been stuck so long on it I bet there has been others who have run into similar issues. I'm amazed how expensive these motors cost on Amazon etc for like [imath]500+[/imath]120-200 a control board, when people give treadmills away for free all the time, I'd think someone could create a business off just scraping treadmills and cleaning and reselling the motors and boards for a discount and still make good money since it's nearly pure profit. I just don't think there would be enough people willing to buy them used.

 

[Sirchawlez]

I'll try the pins you mention for my pwm and let you know if it all works or not. 1 and 4 you said starting from the closest pin to the ground connection spots? Thanks again. And I'll definitely link maker.pro and your account name for credit if I make a video too if that is ok with you and is ok with the site. Sorry one last thing the motor choke, where would I put that into the circuit? Between the motor and the board ? Spliced/connected into the wires coming from the motor between the board/motor? I actually think the last pair of connections might be for the incline motor to connect to the board, does that sound right ?

 

[Minder]

For the PWM pin you should do a trace of the the pins and if like the MC2100, there should be a 4 pin Opto isolator that then goes to the processor.
On the MC2100 ver. the series resistor is quite small value, so most interfaces require an added series res the value depends on the voltage used by the controller.
Any motor choke should be wired between the motor and board, some are two wire, some 4 wire.
This is the 4 wire type.

 

[Sirchawlez]

Awesome thanks, and the choke I have is a 2 wire one, in regard to adding a resistor you say depends on the voltage of the controller, you mean the board right? Not the pwm? Or the pwm? And the pwm I have is 9v-60v 12amp 500watt, so if that is what you were referring to what size resistor would be adequate in your opinion? And is that something I could possibly find and remove/desolder from a different source/board and add? I just have several extra boards and multiple others from random electronics so if I can repurpose that would be ideal! One other question for you is the board I have in picture that is an endex dcmd77n, seems to be the most simple board out of the bunch I think? Would you mind telling me where the pwm would connect to on it? If it's the same as other board my apologies it just doesn't look the same overall the connections are in different places, I only ask because of the simplicity of the board but also because I have the choke wired into it already and also have switch/fuse in place for it AND this motor actually has it's brushes already, I'd much rather use the motor and board we have been discussing but I am missing the brushes for the motor currently so for the time being the motor is a paperweight until I get or find the missing brush for it. Should've mentioned that in original post I know! Sorry I wish I was more knowledgeable in regard to this kind of stuff but I am learning from you and only need to be told something once typically so it's all very helpful!

 

[Minder]

If it has the typical Opto PC817 etc, then the input diode has to be restricted to 50ma, so requires a total series resistance in order not to exceed this.
I am not familiar with the Endex board.
Most of the motors for the typical TM's will interchange motors.

 

[Sirchawlez]

I scrapped another treadmill today and finally got a mc2100 board In it thankfully so other boards/motors are in a time out for the moment. Thank you so very much for all the assistance though! Very much appreciated it and wish more people were willing to help others out these days! Everyone has sticks up their you know what and take it out on everyone and anyone.

 

[Sirchawlez]

Update, so finally got that mc2100 board and when hooking up the pwm control it doesnt light up at all, no options, tried making sure connections were all good but still won't work. But oddly enough the pwm flashes for a split second (lights up) and immediately goes dark when adjusting the one of 4 pins, don't know if that means anything but super frustrated that I cant get this board to work with the pwm controller, I have literally 3-4 motors and control boards from treadmills and cant manage to get any of the motors running (except when hooked directly to a battery, but that doesnt allow me any control over speed etc) so I know the motors work and boards should too, so does that most likely mean the pwm controller is a dud or underpowered? I thought I read somewhere that even if it was underpowered it would still run the motor but only at a fraction of what it should be powered at? So like 50% of what its rated for? If that's true then I dont get why I am not getting any spin on the motors at all? This is irritating as all heck since I know this should be such a simple project to get going but it's been issue after issue. Any help would be greatly appreciated! I am going to order--DC 10-55V MAX 60A PWM Motor Speed Controller CW CCW Reversible 12V 24V 36V here is the link https://www.ebay.com/itm/112632201224, by the time you reply I would have ordered it. I am HOPING that this will allow me to finally be able to run these motors I have with ease, and the nice addition of a forward and reverse switch would be nice too. Will this be adequate for running these motors most likely? Thanks again.

 

[Minder]

The only issue is that the unit voltage is too low, (36v) in order to control TM motors up to the rated RPM/Torque.
If you tried a PWM command signal on the MC2100 , is the PWM control signal limited to <50ma?
As the Input Opto won't take any more than this.
One symptom is a brief flash of the LED. It should be on steady when powered up, and have a steady regular flash