Trumps solar wall, forget politics we should just build the thing

[32Vwasbetteronboats]

Solar energy absorbing panels on the sound barrier next to the Munich airport.

https://goo.gl/maps/PuhzrDSY7f52
Topaz Solar Farm is a 550-megawatt (MW) photovoltaic power station in San Luis Obispo County, California.

The average amount of incoming solar radiation decreases from the Equator to the poles. This is because the low latitudes (near the Equator) receive relatively large amounts of radiation all year, AND at high latitudes (near the poles), the more oblique angle of the Sun's rays together with long periods of darkness in the winter, result in a low average amount of received radiation.

The southern border is the best place, I can't think of any argument against that.

What are the downsides to having a long line of panels as opposed to a big square ? I tend to think that the long line would allow the transmission lines to be built right in and the power could be sold to cities already on the border instead of building a big square solar farm with a long transmission lines and towers leading away from it to where ever it goes.

 

[32Vwasbetteronboats]

 

[Externet]

You are dreaming. It will last less than a week under a rain of stone throwing. And they will never pay for the damages. They do not even have to pay for their ammunition to destroy it. And the solar panels would be on their south side, if you did not think about it.

 

[32Vwasbetteronboats]

You are dreaming. It will last less than a week under a rain of stone throwing. And they will never pay for the damages. They do not even have to pay for their ammunition to destroy it. And the solar panels would be on their south side, if you did not think about it.

Massive Hail Storm Takes On Over 3,000 Solar Panels And Loses http://denver.cbslocal.com/2017/05/10/solar-panels-survive-hailstorm/
Hailstones up to 2.75 inches in diameter were reported in the area.

 

[32Vwasbetteronboats]

A cross-section of Trump's proposed solar-paneled border wall with Mexico.Gleason Partners LLC

 

[32Vwasbetteronboats]

The Great Wall of China is 13,170 miles long... that's more than twice the length of previous estimates

Meanwhile fake news tells us that in 2017 a long thin solar farm in the desert southwest cant be done, its too difficult.

 

[(*steve*)]

Asking the southern border of the US, the panels would be most efficient if angled at between 26 and 29 degrees (depending on how far west you are (the border is located several degrees more north on the west coast of the US).

At that angle, the wall would not present a particularly significant impediment to someone who has ever walked on the roof of a house.

Electrically speaking, a long thin strip has some actual advantages over a field of smaller panels, but the orientation of the border is not optimal for solar panels. You could get around this by placing the panels at an angle on the wall, but it would only server to make the wall far more easily climbable and make it far harder to observe people trying to do so.

Most solar panels are rated for no more than 1000V, so you would probably need to arrange them in strings bringing the voltage up to maybe 700V, and then employ a vast number of inverters to create AC. You might then be able to use standard transformers to raise the voltage to 160kV or whatever the local standard is for power distribution. In saying this I am completely ignoring how one would keep the entire set of inverters in sync with the rest of the grid.

Solar panels might be resistant to chunks of ice, however it would be naive to suggest that anyone who was sufficiently motivated wouldn't just try larger and larger rocks.

I think it would be just as likely to become a long amusement park with kids using it as a massive slide.

 

[32Vwasbetteronboats]

At that angle, the wall would not present a particularly significant impediment to someone who has ever walked on the roof of a house.

I don't think anyone will want to climb it.

 

[davenn]

I don't think anyone will want to climb it.

only if the power lines actually exist

 

[32Vwasbetteronboats]

Electrically speaking, a long thin strip has some actual advantages over a field of smaller panels, but the orientation of the border is not optimal for solar panels. You could get around this by placing the panels at an angle on the wall, but it would only server to make the wall far more easily climbable and make it far harder to observe people trying to do so.

Most solar panels are rated for no more than 1000V, so you would probably need to arrange them in strings bringing the voltage up to maybe 700V, and then employ a vast number of inverters to create AC. You might then be able to use standard transformers to raise the voltage to 160kV or whatever the local standard is for power distribution. In saying this I am completely ignoring how one would keep the entire set of inverters in sync with the rest of the grid.

Maybe make the thing a giant hydrogen generator instead then pipe it out ?

I have to think about this one.

 

[32Vwasbetteronboats]

I would imagine if you made something like this several hundred miles long and push water in one side lots of steam would come out the other.

 

[(*steve*)]

I don't think anyone will want to climb it.

Neither do I. But apparently some people want it to keep people out of the US. These people think there are those who would want to climb it.

 

[(*steve*)]

But you make some good points.

If the is builds a solar wall and sells the power to Mexico, they would have a way of making Mexico pay for the wall.

AND it would put all the Mexican coal miners out of work!!

If the US sold the power at a low enough price, it would aside the Mexican economy and probably actually achieve the goal of stopping people wanting to come to the US. The growing Mexican economy would also push up wages, reducing the benefit of outsourcing jobs to Mexico.

 

[Nb778]

That was just a Teaser for the Fake Media and liberals.

This is what is actually being developed.
HE Came up with this idea too of course.

 

[32Vwasbetteronboats]

"Solar energy is already being generated at lower prices than those of coal. With solar plants along vast stretches of the almost 2,000-mile U.S.-Mexico border on the Mexican side, a new high-voltage direct-current (HVDC) grid could be set up to transmit energy efficiently from that long, snaking array to population centers along the border. HVDC power lines lose exponentially less energy over long distances than traditional power lines. http://www.altenergymag.com/story/2...l-let’s-build-a-border-of-solar-panels/25293/

Above was an anomaly, I just Googled "solar wall Mexico" and looked through 17 pages of search results and most of them are negative and bash the idea.

It sounds so generic and like I am a just follower but it is true that the fake media is the thing screwing up America. Searching through those 17 pages completely confirmed that to me.

It could be the greatest green energy project the world has ever seen and all they can do is bash it. Ask one of these "journalists" anything about energy or electricity I bet you would get an answer like you asked a 3rd grader but they write all this crap like they are authorities on everything. No A holes you went to journalism school your not that smart.

Anyway there are alot of creative minds on this website, maybe something someone posts will be the idea that changes everything.

In the sections that are going to be completely straight, some idea to take advantage of that long linear part, what if they put like long drive shafts that were made to turn then tap the twisting power off the ends of it ?

Big ass water pumps for irrigation or something.

 

[Doug3004]

Solar power is a wonderfully geeky way to make electricity--it's quiet, it''s (generally) got no moving parts, and you can put the panels on building roofs that didn't need the sunlight anyway--but in most cases it ends up costing a lot of money for very little power. And I like it too, don't get me wrong... but in most places in the world, it's almost never cheaper than just using grid power.

The folly of building indestructible solar panels is that solar panels work best in climates that don't have weather that involves "stuff falling from the sky" at all. That being--low-lying deserts in equatorial regions. If you installed solar panels and you have to worry about hail, you probably wasted your money (unless you were spending government money, of course...).

A big advantage of solar power is if you can generate it in the day time and then store it for use at night, but the battery capacity to do that easily doubles the startup and running costs of the system. Batteries get old and die, and obtaining new batteries (if you recycle the old ones or not) presents a BIG maintenance cost. For an electric vehicle, the largest operating cost is not the electricity to charge it, it's replacing the batteries when they (regularly) expire.... The only electric vehicles world-wide that have come into common use is trains fed by overhead wires, and the simple reason is because they can avoid the costs of massive storage batteries entirely.

Also (being slightly political) I think the solar wall proposal is at least amusing to watch.
The same brand of eco-leftists who tend to hate Trump are the ones who think that solar power and immigration is good. It's like they've been told they're getting the pony they wanted for Christmas, but they have to shovel the stall out every day....

 

[AnalogKid]

"HVDC power lines lose exponentially less energy over long distances than traditional power lines.

No, they don't.

Ask one of these "journalists" anything about energy or electricity I bet you would get an answer like you asked a 3rd grader

The above quote is a perfect example of that.

ak

 

[Alec_t]

I predict there'll being lots of pairs of alligator clips attached to the solar array, with cables sneaking back over the Mexican border .

 

[32Vwasbetteronboats]

Batteries get old and die

California utility augments 1,800 air conditioning units with “ice battery” https://arstechnica.com/business/20...d-by-utility-will-cool-california-businesses/

“Make hay while the sun shines"

No need for batteries made from toxic metals and acid at least until solar produces more energy then is consumed by air conditioning systems.

Using solar to run the thing all day, I wonder if I could take apart a mini freezer and use the cooling coil to make enough ice to cool a bedroom all night, I should sign up for on of those off grid living forums and throw them that idea. Running AC is the hardest part of that off grid thing.

 

[AnalogKid]

I wonder if I could take apart a mini freezer and use the cooling coil to make enough ice to cool a bedroom all night,

If that is a serious question, then - no.

Air conditioners are rated in tons. A refrigeration ton is the amount of heat transfer needed to melt one ton of ice in 24 hours. Even if the cooling system could move enough heat in 16 hours to cool the room for 8 hours (and, it can't), at a working temperature low enough to freeze water (again, no), the evaporation coil is not large enough to spread out the cold over a large volume of water. After about 1" of ice formed around the coil, that ice would act as an insulator. Plus, there's that whole hundreds of pounds of water thing...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ton_of_refrigeration

ak