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alternative transistor

R

RHRRC

Jan 1, 1970
0
Help!!

I am looking for an alternative to the ST micro. BUV48AFI npn bjt.
It is a 450V Vceo device in a isolated package (ST proprietry
ISOWATT-218 package).
ST are discontinuing it and they have no suitable alternative.


It is not being used in a switcher so these related characteristics
(ton etc) are irrelevant - it is being used in linear mode. What is
important is the package which must be a similar physical size (eg
TO-3P,TO247 ....),it must be isolated (fullpack,FP or whatever) and
the beta must be 30+ at an Ic of 200mA.
Max circuit Ic is 0.5A

Unfortunately a T220 will not do.

Required ~2kper month ongoing for next few years (min 3 yrs)

Regards
 
W

Winfield Hill

Jan 1, 1970
0
Help!!

I am looking for an alternative to the ST micro. BUV48AFI npn bjt.
It is a 450V Vceo device in a isolated package (ST proprietry
ISOWATT-218 package).
ST are discontinuing it and they have no suitable alternative.

It is not being used in a switcher so these related characteristics
(ton etc) are irrelevant - it is being used in linear mode. What is
important is the package which must be a similar physical size (eg
TO-3P,TO247 ....),it must be isolated (fullpack,FP or whatever) and
the beta must be 30+ at an Ic of 200mA.
Max circuit Ic is 0.5A

Unfortunately a T220 will not do.

Required ~2kper month ongoing for next few years (min 3 yrs)

Regards

I'm surprised ST wouldn't be willing to make your
next 72k + parts! Maybe if you bought 100k all at
once, and got a really good price break while you
were at it?
 
L

linnix

Jan 1, 1970
0
Help!!

I am looking for an alternative to the ST micro. BUV48AFI npn bjt.
It is a 450V Vceo device in a isolated package (ST proprietry
ISOWATT-218 package).
ST are discontinuing it and they have no suitable alternative.

It is not being used in a switcher so these related characteristics
(ton etc) are irrelevant - it is being used in linear mode. What is
important is the package which must be a similar physical size (eg
TO-3P,TO247 ....),it must be isolated (fullpack,FP or whatever) and
the beta must be 30+ at an Ic of 200mA.
Max circuit Ic is 0.5A

Unfortunately a T220 will not do.

Why not? We can get one with everything you needed in T220.

Vce 400V
Vbe 9V
Ic 4A
Ib 2A
Pd 75W
 
R

RHRRC

Jan 1, 1970
0
I'm surprised ST wouldn't be willing to make your
next 72k + parts! Maybe if you bought 100k all at
once, and got a really good price break while you
were at it?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Bulk buying stock for the next 3 years is certainly an option that has
been considered.
Somehow I dont like the idea of knowingly using a part which is no
longer available. Somebody's law says that many more, or zero, will be
required and that a bulk purchase will all be right at the bottom of
the spec (devices with a particularly low gain cannot be used).

Win - I am sure you must have come across such an animal as is needed
here.
I live in hope.

regards
 
W

Winfield

Jan 1, 1970
0
RHRRC said:
Bulk buying stock for the next 3 years is certainly an option
that has been considered.
Somehow I dont like the idea of knowingly using a part which
is no longer available. Somebody's law says that many more,
or zero, will be required and that a bulk purchase will all
be right at the bottom of the spec (devices with a particularly
low gain cannot be used).

Win - I am sure you must have come across such an animal as
is needed here.
I live in hope.

What does this part do, what's it used in? How much current
and voltage are you switching, what's the flyback voltage?

It's interesting that the BUV48 is mentioned as a high-voltage
power transistor in ST's old an656 app-note on reading power-
transistor datasheets. Hmm, I wonder if that had anything to
do with its being chosen?

Let's talk about power-transistor packages. As you know,
I'm sure, the TO-220 and its cousins were designed to be
able to replace TO-3 metal-can packages, in that the hole
in the tab and the base and emitter leads are located to
drop right into an unmodified PCB. Now, as for whether a
TO-220 or some other larger package is used, the parameter
to consider is the part's thermal resistance. And, as it
happens, this is determined primarily by the size of the
die inside the package, and not by other aspects of the
package, except of course, an insulating layer, like you
have in your BUV48AFI.

BTW, the BUV48 has a rather large die, no doubt associated
with its capability to switch 15 amps, although one has to
say, not very well! That's because at 15A it has a high
5V saturation voltage, despite being driven by 3A of base
current, for a low saturated-drive beta of only 5. Anyway,
I'd say the large die puts this part in an small group.
(This part's low gain, BTW, comes from its high 1000-volt
Vces rating. Do you need that capability?)

I doubt you're using the BUV48 at such high currents, but
as stated, besides saturation voltage at a given base drive,
an important parameter is the part's thermal resistance.
One transistor you could consider is ON Semi's MJF18008,
which comes in a "fullpack" insulated package.

Vce(sat)
Vces at Ic RthJC
BUV48AFI 1kV 1.5V 8A 2.2C/W
MJF18008 1kV 0.7 4.5 2.78

This part does have a smaller die, hence the lower Ic value
used for the saturation spec, and the higher Rth specs, but
it's not a wimp; it's saturation-voltage plot shows about
Vce 1.5V at 8A, like the BUV48. Anyway, any replacement
decision would depend on how you're using the transistor.

There are larger parts, of course, but not many made with
the fully-insulated feature. Fairchild has an insulated
high-current part, but with a slightly lower 800V Vcbo.

Vce(sat)
Vces at Ic RthJC
BUV48AFI 1kV 1.5V 8A 2.2C/W
FJPF13009 800V 1.5V 8A 2.4C/W

That one looks pretty similar to yours, and shows that
the TO-3P, etc., vs. TO-220 package isn't responsible for
the high-current performance.
 
W

Winfield

Jan 1, 1970
0
RHRRC said:
Win - I am sure you must have come across such an animal
as is needed here.
I live in hope.

regards

Also, did you look at this ST part, HD1750FX ?
 
R

RHRRC

Jan 1, 1970
0
What does this part do, what's it used in? How much current
and voltage are you switching, what's the flyback voltage?

It's interesting that the BUV48 is mentioned as a high-voltage
power transistor in ST's old an656 app-note on reading power-
transistor datasheets. Hmm, I wonder if that had anything to
do with its being chosen?

Let's talk about power-transistor packages. As you know,
I'm sure, the TO-220 and its cousins were designed to be
able to replace TO-3 metal-can packages, in that the hole
in the tab and the base and emitter leads are located to
drop right into an unmodified PCB. Now, as for whether a
TO-220 or some other larger package is used, the parameter
to consider is the part's thermal resistance. And, as it
happens, this is determined primarily by the size of the
die inside the package, and not by other aspects of the
package, except of course, an insulating layer, like you
have in your BUV48AFI.

BTW, the BUV48 has a rather large die, no doubt associated
with its capability to switch 15 amps, although one has to
say, not very well! That's because at 15A it has a high
5V saturation voltage, despite being driven by 3A of base
current, for a low saturated-drive beta of only 5. Anyway,
I'd say the large die puts this part in an small group.
(This part's low gain, BTW, comes from its high 1000-volt
Vces rating. Do you need that capability?)

I doubt you're using the BUV48 at such high currents, but
as stated, besides saturation voltage at a given base drive,
an important parameter is the part's thermal resistance.
One transistor you could consider is ON Semi's MJF18008,
which comes in a "fullpack" insulated package.

Vce(sat)
Vces at Ic RthJC
BUV48AFI 1kV 1.5V 8A 2.2C/W
MJF18008 1kV 0.7 4.5 2.78

This part does have a smaller die, hence the lower Ic value
used for the saturation spec, and the higher Rth specs, but
it's not a wimp; it's saturation-voltage plot shows about
Vce 1.5V at 8A, like the BUV48. Anyway, any replacement
decision would depend on how you're using the transistor.

There are larger parts, of course, but not many made with
the fully-insulated feature. Fairchild has an insulated
high-current part, but with a slightly lower 800V Vcbo.

Vce(sat)
Vces at Ic RthJC
BUV48AFI 1kV 1.5V 8A 2.2C/W
FJPF13009 800V 1.5V 8A 2.4C/W

That one looks pretty similar to yours, and shows that
the TO-3P, etc., vs. TO-220 package isn't responsible for
the high-current performance.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Thanks for the response.

The device is used in linear mode with maximum collector current of
~70mA with a Vce of ~ 100V max in one app. and as a 300mA switch on a
170V supply in another.The important features are Vceo (Vces is not
applicable !!) of 400V or more (noisy environment when transistors
off ), the Beta which would be nice to be 30 plus, and the package
which must be isolated and mechanically compatible with the
ISOWATT-218 in a complex (ish) mechanical assembly that has been
specifically designed around this package.
The TO-3P package is similar enough to fit as probably would a (FP)
TO247 if anyone made such an animal. The TO220 will not.

No I didnt design it - why people design non industry standard parts
into small scale production items that they assume (hope) will have
some production longeveity bemuses me. When a change of a BJT type
requires a major mechanical re-design is unfortunate. When a device is
sourced that does not give the prime requirements on its datasheet(s)
is *&^%ing madness. (Note the ST datasheet for the BUV48AFI offers
neither the gain of the device at anywhere near the currents used, nor
the isolation voltage).
Whilst several manufacturers offer/offered BUV48A's only ST provided
it in the ISOWATT-218 package.
ST hace several parts in this package with appropriate Vceo's but
their current gains are quite low - 'typically' in the low 20's at the
currents of interest which will probably mean some fair number being
supplied with a gain in the teens. These would have to be rejected.

Regards
 
W

Winfield

Jan 1, 1970
0
RHRRC said:
Thanks for the response.

The device is used in linear mode with maximum collector current of
~70mA with a Vce of ~ 100V max in one app. and as a 300mA switch on a
170V supply in another.The important features are Vceo (Vces is not
applicable !!) of 400V or more (noisy environment when transistors
off ), the Beta which would be nice to be 30 plus, and the package
which must be isolated and mechanically compatible with the
ISOWATT-218 in a complex (ish) mechanical assembly that has been
specifically designed around this package.
The TO-3P package is similar enough to fit as probably would a (FP)
TO247 if anyone made such an animal. The TO220 will not.

No I didnt design it - why people design non industry standard parts
into small scale production items that they assume (hope) will have
some production longeveity bemuses me. When a change of a BJT type
requires a major mechanical re-design is unfortunate. When a device is
sourced that does not give the prime requirements on its datasheet(s)
is *&^%ing madness. (Note the ST datasheet for the BUV48AFI offers
neither the gain of the device at anywhere near the currents used, nor
the isolation voltage).
Whilst several manufacturers offer/offered BUV48A's only ST provided
it in the ISOWATT-218 package.
ST hace several parts in this package with appropriate Vceo's but
their current gains are quite low - 'typically' in the low 20's at the
currents of interest which will probably mean some fair number being
supplied with a gain in the teens. These would have to be rejected.

The application crys out for MOSFETs, and no doubt one that fits
mechanically is available, although the 4 to 6-volt gate voltage-
drive would probably be an issue on the existing PCB circuit.
Certainly the 300mA switch would benefit from being a MOSFET.
 
R

Ross Herbert

Jan 1, 1970
0
Help!!

I am looking for an alternative to the ST micro. BUV48AFI npn bjt.
It is a 450V Vceo device in a isolated package (ST proprietry
ISOWATT-218 package).
ST are discontinuing it and they have no suitable alternative.


It is not being used in a switcher so these related characteristics
(ton etc) are irrelevant - it is being used in linear mode. What is
important is the package which must be a similar physical size (eg
TO-3P,TO247 ....),it must be isolated (fullpack,FP or whatever) and
the beta must be 30+ at an Ic of 200mA.
Max circuit Ic is 0.5A

Unfortunately a T220 will not do.

Required ~2kper month ongoing for next few years (min 3 yrs)

Regards

If you look at the product list of ST devices in the same function
group there are a heck of a lot marked NRND and I would be fairly
confident thay aren't about to chop all of them in the very near
future. If they do it doesn't leave them with much.
http://www.st.com/stonline/stappl/p...product$$view=table&querycriteria=RNP139=83.0

My reading of the ST product status is that they still have stock and
as yet there is no dicontinued notice. Have you actually contacted ST
to ascertain a date for discontinuance or are you just going on the
NRND recommendation?
http://www.st.com/stonline/stappl/p...RPNTableView.onClickOfRPNLink&code=66592#83_2

I was not able to locate too many devices which would fit your
requirements but there are a few in the Sanken range which will do it
http://www.sanken-ele.co.jp/en/prod/semicon/ptr/ptr_u/ptr_05e.htm

for example 2SC4557
http://www.sanken-ele.co.jp/en/prod/semicon/pdf/2sc4557e.pdf

The problem will be in finding a supplier.
 
R

Ray King

Jan 1, 1970
0
Is there any chance of looking at a schematicof the circuit?
Ray
 
R

RHRRC

Jan 1, 1970
0
If you look at the product list of ST devices in the same function
group there are a heck of a lot marked NRND and I would be fairly
confident thay aren't about to chop all of them in the very near
future. If they do it doesn't leave them with much.http://www.st.com/stonline/stappl/productcatalog/app?path=/comp/stcom...

My reading of the ST product status is that they still have stock and
as yet there is no dicontinued notice. Have you actually contacted ST
to ascertain a date for discontinuance or are you just going on the
NRND recommendation?http://www.st.com/stonline/stappl/productcatalog/app?path=/comp/stcom...

I was not able to locate too many devices which would fit your
requirements but there are a few in the Sanken range which will do ithttp://www.sanken-ele.co.jp/en/prod/semicon/ptr/ptr_u/ptr_05e.htm

for example 2SC4557http://www.sanken-ele.co.jp/en/prod/semicon/pdf/2sc4557e.pdf

The problem will be in finding a supplier.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Thanks for the response - the 2SC4577 will certainly be investigated.

ST have informed that date that the last orders for the BUV48AFI (and
quite a number of other horiz. deflection/switcher orientated
transistors) will be accepted is sept 2007.
Stocks will obviously remain for a while and the obsolete parts
purveyors will no doubt already have been allocated provision.
 
'Fraid not in this instance.

Yesterday we added thousands of new pdf data book scans to
DatasheetArchive.com. We also improved our cross reference tool to try
and match parametric data from our database. Run some of the part
numbers through our site and see if its any help.

Regards
 

khwr

Jan 22, 2010
1
Joined
Jan 22, 2010
Messages
1
alternative

ASALAM-O-ALEKOM
What is a sutable alternative to small signal transistor 6bt pnp
 
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