Dimmers & LEDs

[[email protected]]

I have a 150W bulb in my study with a dimmer. THe bulb slightly browns the
ceiling.

I am looking to putting in an LED but I keep seeing limitations
referring to "leading edge dimmers". What is this?

I don't trust halogens in my cluttered study.

- = -
Vasos Panagiotopoulos, Columbia'81+, Reagan, Mozart, Pindus, BioStrategist
http://www.panix.com/~vjp2/vasos.htm
---{Nothing herein constitutes advice. Everything fully disclaimed.}---
[Homeland Security means private firearms not lazy obstructive guards]
[Urb sprawl confounds terror] [Phooey on GUI: Windows for subprime Bimbos]

 

[[email protected]]

On Sat, 17 Dec 2011 20:16:48 +0000 (UTC),

I have a 150W bulb in my study with a dimmer. THe bulb slightly browns the
ceiling.

I am looking to putting in an LED but I keep seeing limitations
referring to "leading edge dimmers". What is this?

I don't trust halogens in my cluttered study.

- = -
Vasos Panagiotopoulos, Columbia'81+, Reagan, Mozart, Pindus, BioStrategist
http://www.panix.com/~vjp2/vasos.htm
---{Nothing herein constitutes advice. Everything fully disclaimed.}---
[Homeland Security means private firearms not lazy obstructive guards]
[Urb sprawl confounds terror] [Phooey on GUI: Windows for subprime Bimbos]

Good grief!!! Don't you even know how to use Google!!! Here is the
first of 151,000 hits on 'leading edge dimmer'.
http://sound.westhost.com/lamps/dimmers.html

PlainBill

 

[Phil Allison]

[email protected] wrote:
Good grief!!! Don't you even know how to use Google!!! Here is the
first of 151,000 hits on 'leading edge dimmer'.
http://sound.westhost.com/lamps/dimmers.html

** Rod ( of ESP ) has been testing high efficiency lighting products for
some years now - beginning with my suggestion that the truth about CFLs was
begging to be published somewhere on the net.

What is abundantly clear is that with very few exceptions, the products
being offered to the public and industry are wholly incompatible with
standard AC circuit protection methods and dimming equipment long used with
incandescent lamps.

Egs

1. As little as 100 watts worth of CFLs or LED lights will regularly trip
breakers installed in lighting circuits designs to accept 2000 watts. The
tripping occurs at switch on due to unsuppressed surge spikes.

2. The same CFLs and LED lights cannot be successfully dimmed with common
triac dimmers as installed in millions of premises and WORSE STILL must
never be used in a circuit containing such a dimmer.

I doubt you will find this crucial information on any site other than ESP.



.... Phil

 

[William Sommerwerck]

In the US, several companies (such as GE) sell CFLs that are specifically
labelled as dimmable. This seems less related to the design of the circuitry
that starts the lamp, than it is to the presence of return path that allows
X10 and other signals to pass through the lamp.

I use mostly CFLs from Home Depot, which come on instantly, hit full
brightness in about 30 seconds, and have an excellent color balance. (These
are Consumer Reports' top-rated lamps, though I stumbled onto them -- there
was a nearby Home Depot, and they were cheap -- before CU reviewed them.)

These are not labelled as dimmable, but the X10 system will dim them. (There
are only about 8 or 9 steps from "max" before the lamp goes out.) There's a
catch, however.

If you use a conventional X10 plug-in wall dimmer to dim them, the lamp will
blink several times a second when you turn it off. The reason is that the
dimmer pulses the line periodically to determine when you've cycled the
power switch on the lamp itself. (This lets you turn on the lamp without
using the X10 controller.) The dimmer notes the off/on change in current,
and supplies full power. If you then command the dimmer to shut off the
lamp, it will continue to pulse the line.

According to X10, you need to use an X10 wall-switch dimmer, which doesn't
pulse the line. I haven't yet checked this.

 

[[email protected]]

** Rod ( of ESP ) has been testing high efficiency lighting products for
some years now - beginning with my suggestion that the truth about CFLs was
begging to be published somewhere on the net.

What is abundantly clear is that with very few exceptions, the products
being offered to the public and industry are wholly incompatible with
standard AC circuit protection methods and dimming equipment long used with
incandescent lamps.

Egs

1. As little as 100 watts worth of CFLs or LED lights will regularly trip
breakers installed in lighting circuits designs to accept 2000 watts. The
tripping occurs at switch on due to unsuppressed surge spikes.

2. The same CFLs and LED lights cannot be successfully dimmed with common
triac dimmers as installed in millions of premises and WORSE STILL must
never be used in a circuit containing such a dimmer.

I doubt you will find this crucial information on any site other than ESP.



... Phil

OK, so neither you nor Rod know what a 'leading edge dimmer' is, and
aren't either smart or ambitious enough to look it up for yourself. I
had a pretty good idea, and decided to do a little research before
spouting nonsense. To bad you haven't done the same.

Point 1. A conventional circuit breaker would certainly be imune to
any type of transients; a GFCI breaker should be immune to transients,
but I will admit a poorly designed one might not be. Since an AFCI
breaker is designed to detect and trip on transients, it should be
obvious that a dimmer for LEDs would be likely to trip one.

Point 2. The incompatibility between conventional dimmers and CCFL /
LED lighting is well known, documented on most packages of the
lighting products, as well as the first few of the sources I found in
by the search. Anyone who is surprised by this fact can only be
described as 'willfully ignorant'.

Further, I am amused by the idea that someone purporting to be an
expert would rely on anecdotal information on something critical to
his area of expertise.

PlainBill

 

[Phil Allison]

OK, so neither you nor Rod know what a 'leading edge dimmer' is,

** OK - you tell us what one is then.

Boy oh boy - YOU are just begging for it !!

You fucking SMUG PRICK !!!

Point 1. A conventional circuit breaker would certainly be imune to
any type of transients;

** Shame how everyone's experience and maker's published specs say otherwise
!!

You bullshitting, brainless PIG !!!

Point 2. The incompatibility between conventional dimmers and CCFL /
LED lighting is well known, documented on most packages of the
lighting products, as well as the first few of the sources I found in
by the search.

** The words " non dimmable" on a pack convey NOTHING about what I posted
above and is detailed on the ESP site. A serious problem arises when a CFL
is plugged into a circuit that has a standard triac dimmer - regardless of
the setting - that makers do not mention.

Fact: most so called " non-dimmable" CFLs are dimmable with a variac.

Further, I am amused by the idea that someone purporting to be an
expert would rely on anecdotal information on something critical to
his area of expertise.

** Not one thing is anecdotal here - you BULLSHITTING PRICK.

I did extensive tests on many different CFLs and so did Rod Elliot - the
results are published on his site.

Your IGNORANCE IS MONSTROUS.

FOAD.



.... Phil

 

[[email protected]]

*+-Why not simply glue a piece of aluminum foil on the ceiling directly

That's exactly what my late dad did in 1999.
That's what brought the problem to my attention.

Thanks to everyone for well considered answers.


- = -
Vasos Panagiotopoulos, Columbia'81+, Reagan, Mozart, Pindus, BioStrategist
http://www.panix.com/~vjp2/vasos.htm
---{Nothing herein constitutes advice. Everything fully disclaimed.}---
[Homeland Security means private firearms not lazy obstructive guards]
[Urb sprawl confounds terror] [Phooey on GUI: Windows for subprime Bimbos]

 

[[email protected]]

I was afraid of that. Unfortunately "leading edge dimmers" was in small print
and not on the online ad before I ordered.

*+-Point 2. The incompatibility between conventional dimmers and CCFL /
*+-LED lighting is well known, documented on most packages of the
*+-lighting products, as well as the first few of the sources I found in
*+-by the search. Anyone who is surprised by this fact can only be
*+-described as 'willfully ignorant'.


- = -
Vasos Panagiotopoulos, Columbia'81+, Reagan, Mozart, Pindus, BioStrategist
http://www.panix.com/~vjp2/vasos.htm
---{Nothing herein constitutes advice. Everything fully disclaimed.}---
[Homeland Security means private firearms not lazy obstructive guards]
[Urb sprawl confounds terror] [Phooey on GUI: Windows for subprime Bimbos]

 

[[email protected]]

An aside on LEDs - they lead me to be more cluttered because I don't "see"
as much mess. I have been using a lot of smaller LEDs since 2005 but I really
don't trust CFLs.

I was alarmed to see many larger LEDs have built in fans. I asked at a trade
show and was told the step-down transformer was the source of heat and that
spozably the newer diode-based bulbs would be cooler.

- = -
Vasos Panagiotopoulos, Columbia'81+, Reagan, Mozart, Pindus, BioStrategist
http://www.panix.com/~vjp2/vasos.htm
---{Nothing herein constitutes advice. Everything fully disclaimed.}---
[Homeland Security means private firearms not lazy obstructive guards]
[Urb sprawl confounds terror] [Phooey on GUI: Windows for subprime Bimbos]

 

[Phil Allison]

<[email protected]

I was afraid of that. Unfortunately "leading edge dimmers" was in small
print
and not on the online ad before I ordered.

** Did it say you can or cannot use them ??


... Phil