Part identification help?

[Nonsheep]

Hello, I am new to this forum. I have exhausted all options trying to repair an IPC camera PCB. It obviously has one "popped" circuit, but I don't know if this is an on-board battery, capacitor, or what!?!?!? Can anyone offer any opinions after reviewing my photo?

(This PCB is a middle board on a series of four 38mm PCB inside a network camera, the board that has the problem I believe is the CMOS board and it is mainly a support board for a Hi3516 IC (HiSilicon). I have tried to locate a replacement board and was unsuccessful. The part in question is not marked.)

 

[bertus]

hello,

the part looks like a backup battery.
the size will be determent for replacement.

the wiki has a page about battery sizes.
yours is a button battery:

List of battery sizes - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

bertus

 

[73's de Edd]

Sir Nonsheep . . . .

It is an on-board battery.
Not sure of its chemical makeup nor its output voltage being 1.2 or 3V with the latter being MOST likely.
Why not take ohmmeter in hand, set to its lowest ohms scale and probe the corner hex brass spacers , at the gold flashed pad between them and measure over to the top case of the 24Mhz clock oscillator module, confirming an expected direct short, and then move one probe off and over to the modules top cover and then use the other probe to probe to the two battery connector tabs to the PCB.
See which is grounded and thereby being your negative terminal and then unsolder and remove the old battery and initially use an AA or AAA cell to use as a battery source, flying wire connected, and then see if any operational results .
AND THEN ! up the battery voltage, to being 2 series cells and NOW the MORE LIKELY possibility of some favorable results.
OR the horrible possibility that this powered a volatile memory and is now dependent upon being rebooted for operationality . . . .
however, usually, most critical programming is being on permanent RAM and incorruptible, with this cell being related to trickle powering temporary memory storage . . .you hope.
Usually these cells are feed by an isolation diode and voltage dropping / current limiting resistor from a 5V on board supply to supplementary trickle charge them.
Then, usually the memory can still work solely with this trickle level voltage . . . . . . . . UNTIL . . . . . turnoff where all info is lost.
Eventually atrophy and internal cell leakage resistance constantly pulls that meager supply down below a working threshold.
Notice the present cells external case and its present debasement down to "THE GREEN GLOOOOMPHS ! "

73's de Edd . . . . .

I'm maddern' hell . . . .
STOP! . . . . . killing our ducks . . . . . to make duck tape!

.

 

[Nonsheep]

Thankx 73, you're a smart dude. Some of that flew over my head, but I think I can grasp most of it and I'll give it a try and report back soon. Thank you!

 

[Nonsheep]

I successfully added a 1.5v battery, but the camera is not working, so possibly there was other non-visable damage to one of the PCB. Would you (73's de Edd) know how to repair an IP camera, or know anyone you can refer me to? I actually have several that need repairs.

 

[Delta Prime]

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[Nonsheep]

Thank you!

 

[Nonsheep]

I looked up the links, I should have been more detailed. I am dealing with IP CCTV cameras, not DSLR etc, it is apples & oranges.

 

[Delta Prime]

I looked up the links, I should have been more detailed. I am dealing with IP CCTV cameras, not DSLR etc, it is apples & oranges.

Well then, I must learn to like fruit salad.
Thank you for the information. Perhaps you can volunteer your very general geographical location. For instance North America South America things of that nature.
For shipping purposes.
I will see if I cannot be of more service to you...thank you for the reply.

 

[kellys_eye]

Would you know how to repair an IP camera,

Not an easy task and more often than not so complicated (and therefore expensive) that most don't bother. They are now 'too cheap' to be worth it.

That said, the only real way of tackling it is with some sophisticated test and repair equipment. Start by identifying the main ICs on the boards and download the datasheets for them. You can then figure out what signals you might expect to see at certain places on the boards and test for them. As with any other fault finding process, working 'backwards' through the boards (testing for supply voltages first, signals second etc) you might find the dud part.

If you have two identical cameras you could do board swapping to see if you can locate the fault to a specific board rather than an individual part.

Then comes the 'sophisticated' repair part. Specialist tools are often required to remove/replace the dud parts - assuming you can even get a replacement. If it's a 'coded' part (i.e. has internal programming) then you're stuck.

 

[Nonsheep]

I am in 90232 USA.
I thought about swapping boards to test, but I do not have an identical camera. Funny (NOT) how these cameras with identical specs, even same image sensors (Sony IMX185) do not use the same supporting boards. I am not an electrical engineer like most of you guys, I'm just a layman, I can swap parts out, but can not identify the actual problem part(s). I have no idea what costs are involved with a repair like this. If I could get this camera working it would be worth $100 to me. I have about a 1/2 dozen other IP cameras that are down, but they are not worth as much as this one. If I could buy a new camera with the same internals I would do it, but I can't find them anymore.

Solution or not, thank you all for your help & efforts!

 

[kellys_eye]

If I could get this camera working it would be worth

I'd guess it would take around 3 hours to fix and the usual rates of $75/hr (and that's CHEAP) make it's 'worth' (to you) 'worthless'. Sorry, but that's the way the world works these days.

If you can correctly and accurately describe the actual fault symptoms we may be able to offer some assistance. When you changed the battery did you install it correctly, clean the circuit board, check for shorts, measure the in-circuit voltage etc?

 

[Bluejets]

Bin it.
When the memory battery such as this goes south as dramatically as this did, one can be certain it would have taken the flash memory with it and possibly even the micro itself.

 

[73's de Edd]

Sir Nonsheep . . . . . .


I successfully added a 1.5v battery, but the camera is not working,
I'm expecting that battery voltage to be up in the 3.6 v-4.2 V like from a conventional lithium cell range . . . . 1.5 V wouldn't START to do its task.
Think of our cells that we typically use in digital wristwatches or computer memory in the CR2032 series.
It does look like that your roaming piece of black Zip A.C. line cord DID get the proper polarity install with the negative terminal at edge of board and positive as the inside board connection.
One board dates 2015 as its vintage initial developmental stage . If this is a IP IMX 185 the newer models don't even LOOK like this.
The frontal Zoom and focus mechanics look circa 90's - 2K.
You did not show the round back cover and its connections . . . . expecting 12 or 5 VDC basic power, plus that first board at the back would be interesting, since it should be power derivation / distribution related.

73's de Edd . . . . .

Coming up ! . . . . .
Thanksgiving is cooking for fully 4 solid hours or more, to then just gobble it up in 10 minutes, now, isn't this being the biggest scam in America ?

.

 

[kellys_eye]

Not a fan of IP cameras (or wifi versions for that matter). Give me AHD (over coax or twisted pair) any day! I recently got hold of a couple of older PTZ CCTV units and a couple of spare CCTV camera modules to play with.

One of the CCTV PTZ units has an unusual - in my experience - worm/gear movement and another has a precision servo (rather than the usual stepper) movement.

Despite having a comprehensive CCTV coverage of my property (for wildlife as well as security measures) I'm never happy! All I'm missing now is an FLIR version and an 'all sky' camera setup.

Old PTZ units are easy and cheap to obtain, can be run over a single CAT5 cable (pair for video via a balun, pair for RS458 control and the rest for power) and many are sold as 'non-working' only because the seller hasn't a clue how to use the control signal lines!

 

[Nonsheep]

I have installed CCTV for about 35 years, so I am not ignorant to these cameras. Anyone that says analog cameras are as good or better then IP cameras have no clue what they are talking about, or have never actually seen the resolution of a quality IP camera.
And kellys_eye snide comments are not appreciated at all. If it takes 3 hours to fix a 38mm PCB then you are in the wrong business. Kindly leave this thread if you are not going to offer any positive & constructive help.

Back to the matter.... I used the 1.5v button battery solely because I was matching size with the blown part, I have never seen a 3v lithium that small, but I certainly haven't seen it all. I did follow the CONSTRUCTIVE advice from "73's de Edd" in testing the ground & soldering a lead to affix an external battery. I'll try a CR2025 and see if it helps at all.

 

[Delta Prime]

What a small world!
I work live and play right by the Huntington library. I feel like fixing it for you!
For free...
Forgive me if you have already tried Yelp. Two of these companies I have used but not for IP cameras for other security measures.
If you're not satisfied with any of these companies I will try again just say the word....
Obviously ignore the CCTV part.

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[kellys_eye]

Anyone that says analog cameras are as good or better then IP cameras have no clue what they are talking about, or have never actually seen the resolution of a quality IP camera.

I never made or inferred any quality comparisons however most of my AHD cameras are 2Mp (1920x1080) although I'm about to purchase 4k versions for some positions (my fish pond) so quality, as such, has never been called into question for my application.

And kellys_eye snide comments are not appreciated at all. If it takes 3 hours to fix a 38mm PCB then you are in the wrong business.

Really? Given I've been in the electronics servicing/repair business for 45 years I reckon I know what I'm talking about too. The 'size' is much of the problem when it comes to SMD servicing - I should know.

But if you sent that PCB (rather ALL of them as any serving would require the whole unit) to any repair shop expecting a repair to be done in 'minutes' you clearly have no concept of the sharp end of such work. This the attitude of 'board swappers'. I quote three hours on the basis that 'you' have had a go at it and likely introduced more problems than might have originally existed - another issue service engineers have to contend with. Perhaps the biggest (and worst) issue is that obtaining schematics for CCTV cameras is almost impossible. That in itself introduces time constraints as far as repairs are concerned.

I used the 1.5v button battery solely because I was matching size with the blown part,

and with an approach like that I'd be charging $150/hour too!

 

[Nonsheep]

3v CR2032 did not help either, likely there is other damage on one or more of the boards.
Photo is just an FYI. These high end models have more PCB's then typically found in IP cameras.

 

[Martaine2005]

And my friend, that is why nobody wants to repair them!. It can take hours to trace out the boards. Schematics are non existent too. Part numbers are also normally scrubbed off.
So your comment on a small board is seriously over looked as ignorance on your part.
If you had 20 units, it’d be worth paying someone to reverse engineer the troublesome spot and repair them. It might take many hours for the first one, then half hour or even 15 minutes for the next few.
Simply saying a “38mm x 38mm” board is small so it won’t take long to repair is terribly ignorant.
Just my 2 cents!

Martin