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Education & Jobs in Electronics

kellys_eye

Jun 25, 2010
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are there electronics work environments where you are not an automaton or a cog in the company gears?
It's called 'self-employment'. Get good at something (doesn't even have to be electronic related) and work for yourself.
 

HAROLDYOUNG

Jul 15, 2023
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We’re all being trolled!.
Not a single answer just more questions.
Don't see where not answering questions make someone a Troll? How did you come up with that definition.

I think you need to Relax.

Troll Definition:

to antagonize (others) online by deliberately posting inflammatory, irrelevant, or offensive comments or other disruptive content
… trolls engage in the most outrageous and offensive behaviors possible—all the better to troll you with.

… is also notorious, for trolling message boards on the Internet, posting offensive material he himself has written and then suing anyone who responds in agreement.

: a person who intentionally antagonizes others online by posting inflammatory, irrelevant, or offensive comments or other disruptive content
Internet trolls

In the late 1980s, Internet users adopted the word "troll" to denote someone who intentionally disrupts online communities.
 

HAROLDYOUNG

Jul 15, 2023
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Where'd you go?
All this stuff may look scary.
But to me it's scary fun.
I appreciate your thoughtful responses. Hope they help anyone else who has the same questions about getting into electronics.
It seems somewhat like a lifestyle and labor of love besides being a job skill. Probably anyone really good at it don't just work
9 to 5 then go home and forget about it, but rather continue on in the garage. Something like a mad scientist. That's ok for
those inclined in such a way. I'm still evaluating if its for me. The lifestyle aspect is also important, not just the job aspect.
 

Delta Prime

Jul 29, 2020
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those inclined in such a way. I'm still evaluating if its for me. The lifestyle aspect is also important, not just the job aspect
Well that's good to hear, lifestyle very important.
I'm not married yet and have no children yet. I say this because being employed as a contractor for aerospace when they have a large production run I'm usually called up to assist and in doing so I meet all types but specifically the individuals there put in their time like they're there for 30 years already working on their pension plan retirement and that company went South got bought out there was no parachute , 401K went to shit. The last day of my contract they had a emergency exit simulation where everyone in the facility would step out, away from the building it was like clockwork but always unannounced so they were used to it. But this time when we all walked out.... a private security Force rolled up in vehicles chain locked all the doors and stood in front of them and the announcement was made to the employees of the disbandment of the company with the aid of a bull horn loudspeaker.They we're escorted back into the facility one by one to pick up their personal belongings and were ordered to vacate building or be arrested for trespassing.ls that's some sad crap or what?
Seeing all this unfold before me there are people actually crying emotions ran high and I felt pity for the employees and how we are all treated like something other than human beings..
... when my name was called out well...
 
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HAROLDYOUNG

Jul 15, 2023
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Well that's good to hear, lifestyle very important.
I'm not married yet and have no children yet. I say this because being employed as a contractor for aerospace when they have a large production run I'm usually called up to assist and in doing so I meet all types but specifically the individuals there put in their time like they're there for 30 years already working on their pension plan retirement and that company went South got bought out there was no parachute , 401K went to shit. The last day of my contract they had a emergency exit simulation where everyone in the facility would step out, away from the building it was like clockwork but always unannounced so they were used to it. But this time when we all walked out.... a private security Force rolled up in vehicles chain locked all the doors and stood in front of them and the announcement was made to the employees of the disbandment of the company with the aid of a bull horn loudspeaker.They we're escorted back into the facility one by one to pick up their personal belongings and were ordered to vacate building or be arrested for trespassing.ls that's some sad crap or what?
Seeing all this unfold before me there are people actually crying emotions ran high and I felt pity for the employees.
... when my name was called out well...
That is pretty cold but not surprising and I've heard other stories like that about employees coming to work and the doors were chained up, company out of business. I suppose they are allowed to do that by law. I've worked in other companies (not electronics) where
employees were layed off just before they were eligible for pensions or other benefits after being there for 20 or so years.
Just goes to show that today you cannot rely on a company for financial security. Of course that's one reason unions were formed
besieds employee abuse. Even in the past few years I read of a worker falling into a molten vat of steel due to lax safety by the company.
Can't rely on a job. Have to get your own security somehow. Now with AI coming up, who knows what's going to happen?
 

kellys_eye

Jun 25, 2010
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The lifestyle aspect is also important, not just the job aspect.
There are many routes in electronics that can have large bearing on your lifestyle. My route began in the marine industry as a radio officer with a large shipping company. This took me all over the world as I was responsible for ship-shore comms and the maintenance of all the electronics onboard the ships I served on.

Years thereafter I joined a marine electronics company and travelled the world installing and repairing all sorts of comms and nav equipment including satellite stuff. Not only on ships but shoreside locations too.

Some jobs will have you sat at a desk 24/7. Others stood at an assembly line or driving all over the place or even flying all over the place. The further you go somewhat depends on the practical skill levels you can exhibit as it is expensive to send someone off to fix dud equipment if they can't actually do it!

Your original question related to the spec/quallies and remuneration in the industry but you have to make the primary decision of what YOU want from the job before you can take this any further.
 

bidrohini

Feb 1, 2023
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Yeah. You're right sir. I am not saying that it has to be somebody's ultimate career goal. But it can be the beginning of the career. I am from south-east Asia. When working as an Engineer, I had many teenage colleagues. They were from poor families. They used to work as technicians while studying at the vocational school. Many of them had the full potential to be BSc engineers in the future. Many of them will become, hopefully. I had a colleague too who started like this due to poverty. He developed his skills and continued his studies with his hard-earned money. He is a Bsc Engineer now.
 

bidrohini

Feb 1, 2023
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It is enough and you'll soon find out how easy it is to run circles around engineers.
Yeah. You're right sir. I am not saying that it has to be somebody's ultimate career goal. But it can be the beginning of the career. I am from south-east Asia. When working as an Engineer, I had many teenage colleagues. They were from poor families. They used to work as technicians while studying at the vocational school. Many of them had the full potential to be BSc engineers in the future. Many of them will become, hopefully. I had a colleague too who started like this due to poverty. He developed his skills and continued his studies with his hard-earned money. He is a Bsc Engineer now.
 

Delta Prime

Jul 29, 2020
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Just when I thought I was out...they pull me back in....
Yeah. You're right sir. I am not saying that it has to be somebody's ultimate career goal. But it can be the beginning of the career. I am from south-east Asia. When working as an Engineer, I had many teenage colleagues. They were from poor families. They used to work as technicians while studying at the vocational school. Many of them had the full potential to be BSc engineers in the future. Many of them will become, hopefully. I had a colleague too who started like this due to poverty. He developed his skills and continued his studies with his hard-earned money. He is a Bsc Engineer now.

See above and below quotes.

Yeah. You're right sir. I am not saying that it has to be somebody's ultimate career goal. But it can be the beginning of the career. I am from south-east Asia. When working as an Engineer, I had many teenage colleagues. They were from poor families. They used to work as technicians while studying at the vocational school. Many of them had the full potential to be BSc engineers in the future. Many of them will become, hopefully. I had a colleague too who started like this due to poverty. He developed his skills and continued his studies with his hard-earned money. He is a Bsc Engineer now.
Great example of the conservation of energy.
:rolleyes:
 

HAROLDYOUNG

Jul 15, 2023
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Without experience you need theory and education that is science that is math that is algebra, geometry,trigonometry
How to transpose equations.
Your train of thought is what they are looking for.
Assemblers need to know the actual components through hole and surface mount and simple mathematics. Multiply,divide fractions. They need to know the dimensions of the components themselves and the values of those components.

SMD resistors and SMD capacitors


View attachment 59879

View attachment 59882
SOT-23 is used for small-signal transistors and measures 2.9 mm x 2.4 mm x 1.1 mm.
SOT-323 is used where you need to fit in a smaller space and measures 2.1 mm x 2.1 mm x 0.9 mm.
SOT-523 is used where you need the ultimate small size and measures 1.6 mm x 1.6 mm x 0.7 mm

View attachment 59880

SMD Integrated Circuits
There are five main package types for SMD integrated circuits (ICs).

Small outline integrated circuit (SOIC)
Small outline package (SOP)
Quad flat pack (QFP)
Plastic leaded chip carrier (PLCC)
Ball grid array (BGA).
In addition, some SMD package types for ICs have multiple styles. SOP packages provide an example.
Thin small outline package (TSOP)
Shrink small outline package (SSOP)
Thin shrink small outline package (TSSOP)
Quarter-size small outline package (QSOP)
Very small outline package (VSOP)
There are also different styles of QFP packages for surface mount devices.
Low profile quad flat pack (LQFP)
Plastic quad flat pack (PQFP)
Ceramic quad flat pack (CQFP)
Thin quad flat pack (TQFP)
Some through all components.

View attachment 59881
Need to know ohm's law.
View attachment 59883

You Said:

"Your train of thought is what they are looking for."

With metal or wood you have physical objects to work with.
With electricity or electronics there are no visible physical objects to work with just numbers.
What is the best mental approach or way to view the non-physical objects (electricity) that
you are working with and are supposed to fix or manipulate?

Non-physical workpiece is the issue.
 

Delta Prime

Jul 29, 2020
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With electricity or electronics there are no visible physical objects to work with just numbers
Well .... I'll tell you right now! "Take the blue pill". It will take the edge off, as we dive into this rabbit hole.
Two words; electromagnetic phenomena.
Human beings love describing nature, how it works.
Electricity is a naturally occurring Electromagnetic Phenomenon & is a fact only because we observe it with our eyeballs or eyeball (The mind's eye) & we do so indirectly.
We observe the end results.
It is concept,that one must imagine through analogies, (descriptions, mathematical equations) so you may have a frame of reference in your mind's eye. Science, physics as we speak.... is looking for an equation or set of equations that can describe this phenomenon.
For electrical electronic circuit theory, Ohm's law is use to paint a picture of the behavior of electronic circuits.
We don't fully understand this phenomenon yet but as you stated we can manipulate it.We can measure it! If you're not careful it can also kill you.
In this pictorial comic of Ohm's law voltage is pushing amperes through a restriction (a bottle neck) of resistance .
Ohms is a standard unit of electrical resistance.
No, voltages arm is not stuck in amperes... you know what.

1690083336118.jpg

1690083692781.png
 
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HAROLDYOUNG

Jul 15, 2023
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Well .... I'll tell you right now! "Take the blue pill". It will take the edge off, as we dive into this rabbit hole.
Two words; electromagnetic phenomena.
Human beings love describing nature, how it works.
Electricity is a naturally occurring Electromagnetic Phenomenon & is a fact only because we observe it with our eyeballs or eyeball (The mind's eye) & we do so indirectly.
We observe the end results.
It is concept,that one must imagine through analogies, (descriptions, mathematical equations) so you may have a frame of reference in your mind's eye. Science, physics as we speak.... is looking for an equation or set of equations that can describe this phenomenon.
For electrical electronic circuit theory, Ohm's law is use to paint a picture of the behavior of electronic circuits.
We don't fully understand this phenomenon yet but as you stated we can manipulate it.We can measure it! If you're not careful it can also kill you.
In this pictorial comic of Ohm's law voltage is pushing amperes through a restriction (a bottle neck) of resistance .
Ohms is a standard unit of electrical resistance.
No, voltages arm is not stuck in amperes... you know what.

View attachment 59967

View attachment 59968
From what little I understand (I've been reading) the movement of the electrons orbiting the nucleus of an atom
is what is being worked with and manipulated jumping from one atom to another down the line. That this invisible
stream of microscopic particles is the whole ball game with electricity, and that there are mathematical laws that
govern the movement and manipulation of those particles so they can be used for doing work in the real world
is really amazing. The fact that they are invisible to the naked eye, and probably invisible in a microscope
yet can be harnessed to do things like a lever or spring or whatever, is kind of mind boggling. But the fact that these
particles called electrons have yet to be seen with the human eye takes the cake. I suppose it's the same with atomic energy
being so powerful yet the particles that create that absurd amount of energy are also invisilble. Even more amazing is that
atomic energy and electricity come from the same place, yet electricity does not have the power to blow up the world
like atomic energy does. Like I said I've been reading about this stuff. Most people don't even understand what electricity
is, including myself and yet where would we be today without those invisible particles dominating the planet.

Could a person get by learning (and working at) electronics / electricity with just that pie shaped ohms law chart you posted,
or do you need more advanced math?

Thanks
Harold
 

Delta Prime

Jul 29, 2020
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The imagination is a wonderful thing. Electrons rotating around a nucleus in an elliptical orbit is a fallacy. Current flow in a electrical circuit is a fallacy. But it paints a picture in the mind. If you go chasing rabbits.Remember what the door mouse said." Feed your head "!
:cool:
 
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HAROLDYOUNG

Jul 15, 2023
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The imagination is a wonderful thing. Electrons rotating around a nucleus in an elliptical orbit is a fallacy. Current flow in a electrical circuit is a fallacy. But it paints a picture in the mind. If you go chasing rabbits.Remember what the door mouse said." Feed your head "!
:cool:
So what is current flow if not electrons moving from one atom to the next on down the line?

Is there a reality in electrical flow or what is actually going on that makes it so useful as a force to do work and uphold the modern world?
 

Delta Prime

Jul 29, 2020
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That's just it.... Current does not flow. But you see this is electrical circuit theory. And it's okay and accepted to state that current flows but it is wrong with respect to the physics of electromagnetic radiation. For me to give you an in-depth explanation will require a lot more equations and theorems to be thrown at you. And I wouldn't do that to you. I'm afraid to say Google it but that is a reality today I can only point you in the right direction & take little bites. Let your imagination run wild. The questions that you have posed are a rarity and refreshing in My point of view.
 

HAROLDYOUNG

Jul 15, 2023
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That's just it.... Current does not flow. But you see this is electrical circuit theory. And it's okay and accepted to state that current flows but it is wrong with respect to the physics of electromagnetic radiation. For me to give you an in-depth explanation will require a lot more equations and theorems to be thrown at you. And I wouldn't do that to you. I'm afraid to say Google it but that is a reality today I can only point you in the right direction & take little bites. Let your imagination run wild. The questions that you have posed are a rarity and refreshing in My point of view.
OK I'll Google it, but give me a nutshell explanation to be able to get started. also if you say you have to use equations and theorems to
go into more detail, that makes me wonder if high level math is the only way to understand electricity. Radiation is another animal from
what I know about anything. Are you saying radiation is what electricity and electronics is all about?
 

Delta Prime

Jul 29, 2020
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Tomorrow. It's late where I'm at.
I got to go buddy but I'll post it good night.
 

Delta Prime

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OK I'll Google it, but give me a nutshell explanation to be able to get started.
There's a joke in there somewhere!
If I give you just one video you just going to ask me more questions which is okay.
Start from the bottom up!
Get the popcorn, your favorite beverage. enjoy!


EatingPopcorn.gif


 

HAROLDYOUNG

Jul 15, 2023
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There's a joke in there somewhere!
If I give you just one video you just going to ask me more questions which is okay.
Start from the bottom up!
Get the popcorn, your favorite beverage. enjoy!


View attachment 59983


Thanks

Good stuff..

What's amazing is how intertwined everyday electrical convenience and practical electricity useage is to nuclear forces and potential atomic bomb technology. That is, the electron being so on top of the nucleus of an atom and what power that represents. Probably most people even electronics workers don't realize they are basically working with those same forces as those who construct nuclear weapons.
 
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